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-------------- BEGIN heavenly-c.v001.n027 --------------
001 - mailcall <mailcall@kiva.n - Re: Digest heavenly-c.v001.n023
002 - adamabr@asterix.helix.net - My First Time
003 - Jamieson <beatles@wchat.o - First Time
004 - Tim Baglio <raven@nas.com - Re: First Time
005 - miranda.kaye@stonebow.ota - First Time
006 - "Jefferson F. Morris" <jf - No, gels, it isn't 'O', it's 'E'
007 - Bryan Woodworth <bryanw@6 - I've been letting you down..
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n027.1 ---------------
From: mailcall <mailcall@kiva.net>
Subject: Re: Digest heavenly-c.v001.n023
Date: Tue, 14 May 1996 04:24:53 -0500 (EST)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
: For forty years no one has come up with an explanation. Honora was
: only guilty of being a mother. You can see she is actually close to
: her Mom in the beginning. In fact, Honora is a lot more aware of
: something being wrong than anyone else. Her concern is genuine.
: Yvonne's grades are slipping, her daughter's behavior is changing. She
: is not nagging, she is concerned.
right, this is the way it is shown in the film, but was it really like
that?
for one thing, according to the holy scriptures chapter 3.1.5.5.,
glamuzina and laurie checked the school records and found that pauline's
grades weren't slipping after all! but according to paul's diary, mom
really did say the famous line about "why i should keep a horrid little
child like you in school a minute longer." paul -claimed- right after that
that she'd been wanting to leave school but had said nothing to anyone. i
wonder if that's really true or if she was doing an "oh well, i didn't
want to be in school anyhow."
in real life there was no "letter from old stew" until after pauline was
taken out of school, and it was a letter of concern about her having been
taken out, not about her having failed anything. also, hilda hulme was on
the school board, and wrote a similar letter of concern about pauline's
departure. hilda is on record as having believed that honora was
-extremely- rough on pauline, not just the understandable worry and
"nagging" we see in the picture.
in the faq, there is a section for opinions, and sandra bowdler says "I do
think that the answer lies very much in the character of the real Honora
Parker, and it is hard to be sure what that really was. I do agree that
some kind of abuse is unlikely, it would have come out somewhere."
i know what she means, but remember in those days they did not think of
hitting and yelling as abuse unless it was something very extreme.
otherwise it was just "discipline". likewise with emotional abuse, which
nobody had even heard of in those days.
sandra bowdler also says: "Given the times, Honora Parker might well have
been a very dull, ignorant and hostile working-class NZ housewife. She was
probably a lot less sympathetic than Sarah Peirse's portrayal, and may
have poured scorn on Pauline's aspirations, probably with more venom or at
least irritation than we see in the film. This might be a bit of a class
conflict reading: Pauline aspiring to a more "refined" existence, and her
mother reacting with scorn and possibly anger at Pauline getting above
herself."
what do i think:
i think the key to a lot of paul's natural adolescent rebellion turning to
murderous rage lies in the fact that she was moved from her little shack
to inside the house after nicholas was caught in bed with her. in real
life that house was extremely crowded, even worse than it was shown in the
picture. one of her school friends said pauline's house was "not a home"
and it was "ghastly," you could never have arguments out loud and had to
keep your company face on at all times.
combine this with having left school for digby's, which was also ghastly,
and it's no wonder pauline thought she was going crazy. many kids in that
situation kill themselves, or try to, and paul thought of doing that,
likewise with running away, which they might have done if they hadn't had
their hearts set on leaving the country.
i think paul became a tinderbox after she was moved into the house, and i
think she did go a little crazy. i also think julie had more to do with
the "moider" decision than the film or julie today are willing to admit. i
don't think borovnia or the 4th world actually had much to do with it. i
think those things more symbolised to her the possibilities of a world and
life outside of the ghastly home situation and school regimentation
(sit-t!). she did have a perfectly reasonable career goal, planning to
become a stewardess at first, continue her writing, publish the books and
earn her living as a writer, as was julie (who did so). she did end up in
a world of books, after all! :)
mr porter told me that the 4th world was actually part of a complex
religious system the girls were devising that in some ways was very, very
close to mormonism (the latter day saints). actual mormonism must have hit
juliet like a thunderbolt when she discovered it. in real life, the girls
were -much- more mature and sophisticated than is shown in the film, and
many of the reasons why they decided to go through with the moider have
never really come to light.
mela
*--==--==--*love is real*--==--*imagine*--==--==--*remember*--==--==--*
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n027.2 ---------------
From: adamabr@asterix.helix.net (Adam Abrams)
Subject: My First Time
Date: Tue, 14 May 1996 02:29:08 -0800
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
PS in advance: I'm enjoying all the "first time" stories tremendously!
Here's my humble contribution.
In February of 1995 I was dimly aware of the film, probably because it had
played at the Vancouver Film Festival the previous fall (Sept '94). Its
regular theatrical run started here much later than in the US, I believe
(it was still pretty new in theatres here at this time). And although I
read movie reviews voraciously (the scathing ones are the most fun!),
strangely I had managed to entirely miss this one.
Then I turned on the good old CBC (the venerable Canadian Broadcasting
Corporation, sort of like PBS with commercials and sitcoms mixed in, and no
pledge breaks) one evening and, on a show called "The Arts Tonight", their
reviewer was raving over it. It sounded great - and then they showed the
clips.
There was some of the "she has entered into the spirit of the thing
greatly!" Charles-and-Deborah letter writing scene, the scene with Pauline
first arriving in "Borovnia", with the clay Mario Lanza singing
boisterously, and the wrenching "we're not going to be separated"
phone-call, the whole thing ending on a powerful freeze-frame of Pauline's
glare at Honora as the phone hangs there. Kind of a condensed version of
the main emotional points of the film, in 90 seconds or so. I had to see
it.
Before I could get to the theatre, though, we had our infamous Blizzard of
95. We don't really get much snow here, and what little does fall barely
lasts a day. But predictions were for a real dump of white stuff like we'd
rarely seen - and that weekend, we got a massive blizzard that outdid the
predictions. (I foolishly tried to drive to work that Monday, and thanks to
my pitifully inadequate California tires, got stuck four times in a
(normally) 10-minute drive downtown!) It was just like the Real Winters I'd
almost forgotten about back East.
So February 15, the day after a typically uneventful Valentine's Day (and
Tuesday Discount Night at Vancouver theatres!), the city was still
Christmas-card white as I searched out an obscure art-house theatre on the
West Side, and sat there with a small group of hardy souls who had braved
the snowdrifts. And "Heavenly Creatures" proceed to just knock me out. I
was completely engrossed in it from the beginning to the end, my every
emotion played like a violin in Peter Jackson's expert hands. I recall the
gut feeling of rooting for the girls to somehow escape from their situation
even as my conscious mind knew the terrible outcome ahead. And I recall my
heart pounding during the final, agonizingly tense sequence - never before
had a movie held me so suspended in anxiety and dread!
I left the theatre in a daze, pausing at the glass display to read the
newspaper review thoroughly.
Next Tuesday night, when other plans didn't work out, I thought "hmmm...
that movie's still playing..." and there I was, at a different theatre,
viewing it again. In the following weeks and months, I saw "HC" eight times
at about 6 different theatres!
This movie has been inextricably tied into the Internet for me as well,
mirroring my involvement in that digital phenomenon at every step. I had so
far done nothing much but read newsgroups, so I posted a message in
rec.arts.movies enquiring about the soundtrack to the film. Soon I found
myself in touch with a woman in Columbus, Ohio who shared my passion for
"HC", and also a fellow in New Zealand who actually worked on the
graphics/credits for the film! Ultimately, through him, I was able to get a
copy of the CD... signed by Peter Jackson himself. Unbelievable!
I have also met some wonderful people through email, who were equally moved
by the film, with whom I regularly exchange messages. People in Australia,
Florida, England... And when I determined to learn Web design, there was no
question what my project would consist of - I "HTML'd" the Heavenly
Creatures FAQ.
It has all been quite rewarding - "satisfying indeed".
The film has affected me like nothing else I can recall and is directly
responsible for a newfound interest in Opera (and Mario Lanza!) and a
fascination with the culture, people - and accent! - of New Zealand. On
the one-year anniversary - February 15, 1996 - I was at the Queen Elizabeth
theatre attending my first opera, "Carmen", as a paying ticketholder
(having been a volunteer with the Opera for several months). I hadn't
planned the timing, but it couldn't have been a more appropriate way to
observe the occasion.
Boy, I shudder to think, if I'd somehow missed this movie...! My life would
be quite different and, I'm sure, far less interesting.
Well, hope you enjoyed this rambling tale!
Adam
==========================================================================
Only the best people fight against Adam Abrams
all obstacles... in pursuit of happiness! Vancouver, BC, Canada
--Juliet Hulme, "Heavenly Creatures"
*Visit the "Fourth World" at http://www.helix.net/~adamabr/creatures.html*
==========================================================================
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n027.3 ---------------
From: Jamieson <beatles@wchat.on.ca>
Subject: First Time
Date: Tue, 14 May 1996 07:38:08 -0700
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hi,
Well, this is my very first post here, so this subject is quite appropriate.
The first time I saw Heavenly Creatures was only about 1 month ago. Why was
I so slow in seeing this wonderful film? Because I couldn't find it
anywhere! I had been reading about it from the moment it was released, but
it wasn't showing anywhere out here in the boonies. So, I thought, I'll just
wait until it comes out on video. Well, sooo much time passed that I
actually forgot about it. Until one day I was browsing around in my local
Blockbuster when under the the To Die For videos were the recommended and
related titles, and there it was!
I wasted no time scooping it up and I sped home (exceeding the speed limit,
oh well) and popped it in the machine. I was engrossed from the very first
frame. I found myself laughing with giddiness when the girls danced to The
Donkey Serenade. I cried with happiness when Paul and Juliet finally git to
see each other at the sanitarium. I fell in love with the world of Borovnia
and its characters. And I was pretty much in tears starting with Juliet's
Aria at Ilam until the end of the final credits and Mario Lanza finished
singing.
Unfortunately, I don't have a laser disk player, so I couldn't see that
version, but luckily the video was in letterbox format. Today I'm going to
order the movie for my collection. Of couse, my mother thinks I'm nuts. She
likes the movie, but keps saying to me, "Don't murder me, Erica".
Anyway, that's my tale of the first time I saw the film and I'm happy to
have found others who love it as much as I do.
Bye!
Erica
???????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
???????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n027.4 ---------------
From: Tim Baglio <raven@nas.com>
Subject: Re: First Time
Date: Mon, 13 May 1996 12:52:10 +0000 (GMT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
> order the movie for my collection. Of couse, my mother thinks I'm nuts. She
> likes the movie, but keps saying to me, "Don't murder me, Erica".
Hey... my mom says that to me too.... but my name's not Erica.
_______________________________________________
| |
| Tim Baglio http://www.nas.com/~raven/ |
| raven@nas.com Bellingham, WA |
|_______________________________________________|
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n027.5 ---------------
From: miranda.kaye@stonebow.otago.ac.nz (Miranda Kaye)
Subject: First Time
Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 13:35:03 +1200 (NZST)
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hi -
I've just joined up, and thought I'd enter into the spirit of things
greatly by describing my first experience of HC.
I'm a New Zealander, so I got to see HC in the first few months of its
screen existance. It was shown at the Dunedin Film Festival in mid-1994. It
was the premiere of the film in town, and my friends and I had managed to
score the absolute last tickets to the screening. I knew nothing about the
film but that it was so popular it was sold out. I knew a little of Peter
Jackson - not being a splatter fan, I was a little dubious - and was
curious as to how he'd handle the story of the Parker/Hulme case.
I figured it was going to be interesting.
Simon O'Connor was introduced before the screening - he's a local - and the
whole thing proceeded with a gala-like atmosphere. I was transfixed. Not to
mention transformed. The entire audience was laughing delightedly at the
'Donkey Serenade' sequence, and swaying with the swooping camera work. But
by the time the infamous line in the Victoria Park tea room was spoken,
there was a hush over the audience. No-one laughed at all. Sick with dread,
we all sat and waited for the inevitable blows to rain down on Honora.
Raised on the infamy of Pauline Parker and Juliet Hulme, we all knew how
the tale would proceed.
By the close of the film, I was a nervous wreck - the power of the film and
it's ending stunned me. My friends had to walk me home and ply me with hot
chocolates before I could stop shaking. Honora's cries echoed in my head
for weeks to come.
A few months later, when I was searching for a thesis topic (I'm an MA
student here at U of Otago), the film came flooding back, and my choice was
obvious. Almost two years on, the power of the film hasn't declined, and my
thesis is getting close to finished.
I have made repeated pilgramages to Christchurch - to the site of the
Rieper's house, Ilam, Victoria Park (with my mother, I might add!!) and
CGHS. I would love to know if there is a memorial to Honora anywhere - I
know she was cremated, but I am hoping against hope that there's a little
plaque dedicated to her in a crematorium garden somewhere. I feel compelled
to honour her death in some way.
Like Adam, my relationship with HC has run parallel to my relationship with
the Internet - working with such a new film meant that my email contacts
were invaluable in getting me resources and information. I'd like to praise
Jack Porter most highly for helping me organise my ideas at the start of my
research, and for sending a hard copy of the HC FAQ to the other side of
the world for me. The man's a wonder. So's Luisa Ribeiro.
I would love to hear from others studying HC - I still have so many
questions I want to ask people. I guess they can wait until I settle in!
I'm especially keen to get hold of behind-the-scenes stuff - FX, locations,
gossip - that I can put into my thesis. Any tidbits anyone's got would be
valuable.
BTW, are there any kiwis out there?
later
Miranda.
Miranda Kaye,
Department of English, U. of Otago
Dunedin, New Zealand
ph: +64 3 473 0941
email: miranda.kaye@stonebow.otago.ac.nz
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n027.6 ---------------
From: "Jefferson F. Morris" <jfmorris@CapAccess.org>
Subject: No, gels, it isn't 'O', it's 'E'
Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 01:15:44 -0400 (EDT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
On Tue, 14 May 1996, Adam Abrams wrote:
> The film has affected me like nothing else I can recall and is directly
> responsible for a newfound interest in Opera (and Mario Lanza!)
I combed through a few of my mother's old records after seeing the film.
She's "actually from England" and was about the same age as the girls, so
she was also enamored of Mr. Lanza.
> and a
> fascination with the culture, people - and accent! - of New Zealand.
A note for Americans: If you want to sound like you're from New Zealand,
a good start is to replace your A's with E's and your E's with I's.
"I think she's viry telinted!"
"You're the most ignorant pirson I've ivir mit!"
Yes, it's just that easy.
--Jefferson
P.S. Hope I haven't offended the Kiwis on the list.
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n027.7 ---------------
From: Bryan Woodworth <bryanw@666.org>
Subject: I've been letting you down..
Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 02:19:30 -0700 (PDT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Length: 597
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Dear Subscribers,
My apologies for not being around lately. I have been consumed
with configuring the new machine, along with other issues. I should
be able to devote some time to HeavenlyWeb within the next week.
I'll get around to answering your emails! Please forgive me for
my delay in replying.
Best regards,
Bryan Woodworth
Moderator
Heavenly Creatures Mailing List
--
"'Tis indeed a miracle, one must feel,
that two such heavenly creatures are real." bryan woodworth
-- "Heavenly Creatures," 1994 bryanw@borovnia.666.org
http://www.reflection.org/heavenly/
--------------- END heavenly-c.v001.n027 ---------------
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Subject: Digest heavenly-c.v001.n028
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-------------- BEGIN heavenly-c.v001.n028 --------------
001 - "karen mcquillen" <kmcqui - Mela's Posting
002 - Donald Chin <donaldc@nets - Glamuzina & Laurie book ramblings...
003 - orson@cam.org (Jean Gueri - Re: Glamuzina & Laurie book ramblings...
004 - "Jefferson F. Morris" <jf - Gritty realism and h...h...homo...
005 - adamabr@asterix.helix.net - Re: First Time
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n028.1 ---------------
From: "karen mcquillen" <kmcquillen@ets.org>
Subject: Mela's Posting
Date: Wed, 15 May 96 10:15:30 EDT
Hi Gang,
Sorry, my method of e-mail does not allow me to mark previous messages
easily. I use equipment which is not my own, so thanks in advance for the
advice about what would work, but I probably won't listen!
I'd like to comment on Mela's message about Pauline being wanting to be a
stewardess...I hadn't picked up on that, but it turns out Juliet/Julie/Anne
Perry/Deborah *did* become an airline stewardess. According to Contemporary
Authors, New Revision Series, Volume 22, Anne Perry was an airline stewardess
in Northumberland England, 1962-64. I recall that the Contemporary Authors
bio appears in the so-called holy scripture as well...but who can remember it
all!!!
So, interesting that, in many ways Juliet did get to live out the life
Pauline wanted. But, of course, Pauline wanted Juliet's life in the first
place.
Interesting about the Mormon conntection. That's a great observation. I've
questioned the fact that the Mormon faith seems to be very conservative,
shall I say, about the role of women in society, but in Anne Perry's novels
women take on very strong roles. Some might say she writes from a feminist
perspective. I wonder how she reconciles her faith with what appear to be her
beliefs about "women's rights". True, this is merely in her novels, but I
believe people's personaly thoughts and beliefs come through pretty clearly
in their fiction.
Is alcoholism a red herring in "Leaving Las Vegas"? Just checking....
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n028.2 ---------------
From: Donald Chin <donaldc@netspace.net.au>
Subject: Glamuzina & Laurie book ramblings...
Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 00:37:50 +1000
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hi all,
I have finished reading the G&L book. Quite interesting. It wasn't at all
like the book I imagined it to be. From what I had read of the book from
other people, I thought it would be quite against the portrayal of the
events as shown in the film.
The introduction by B. Ruby Rich critised the film for two points. One was
the folie a deux portrayal of the girl's relationship - that it led to the
murder. Maybe she felt that this just parallels the view that the mass
media and the court trial gave of the case - that the girls were either
"bad" or "mad". I don't think HC looks that way at all. The screenwriters
deliberately went out of their way to give a revisionist view of the whole
case. I feel that they succeeded in a great way. From the evidence in
Paul's diaries, one does get a sense of the fantasy of their world. But to
say, as she did, that the film only shows the girls as "mad" doesn't sound
reasonable. The film tries to show the context of the period in which they
lived, the elements of the girls' family lives, the interactions within
their families as best as the time limitations of a 90 minute film (and the
need for an entertaining film) allowed. These points were brought up in the
main text of G&L and I felt that they were also addressed in the FW/PJ
screenplay.
The other point that was critised the US introduction to the text was the
objective portrayal of the murder. She critises the film's lack of
embellishment during the murder scene, that the murder isn't subjectively
shown in contrast to the way their relationship was shown (in all its
digital wizzardry and animated sequences). He is described as abandoning
the girls to their fate at the point. But wasn't this meant to be the
effect? The screenplay and Sarah Pierse's playing of Honora was meant to
give some sympathy to Honora. Did B. Ruby Rich want the audience to wish
Honora dead - that murder is excusable under extreme circumstances?
Honora's portrayal in the film is only an interpretation. No-one really
knows what she was like. Whatever she was like, she really didn't deserve
to die. The text of G&L mention that Honora was almost a forgotten figure
in the trial and media reporting. So in HC, Honora is brought back to the
fore. We feel sympathy for her and her fate. But PJ/FW doesn't abandon the
girls either. My feeling after I first saw the film was melancholy at the
girls' fate.
As to their lesbian relationship, PJ describes that as a red herring.
Whether it was or wasn't in real life is unknown. The media and trial
seemed to have no qualms in calling their relationship homosexual. G&L
clearly wanted the case seen in a different light to that of the 50's. I
think HC provided that. By PJ exclaming that the relationship was a red
herring, it allows, I think, a break in the link between lesbiansim and
insanity/evil. But, because of the tone of the book and the perspective it
was written from, removing a concrete lesbian aspect to the girls'
relationship could lead to criticism from groups wanting that aspect
emphasised and celebrated. Maybe that is why B. Ruby Rich was so against
the film. Just rambling thoughts after reading the book. I probably should
watch the film again, read the FAQ (again) and then read the book again.
Have anyone else here read the book?
Thanks for putting up with the above...
Regards, Donald
--
Donald Chin <donaldc@netspace.net.au>
"Lost somewhere in Australia...
and fanatical about Heavenly Creatures and Jane Austen!"
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n028.3 ---------------
From: orson@cam.org (Jean Guerin)
Subject: Re: Glamuzina & Laurie book ramblings...
Date: Tue, 14 May 1996 11:37:44 -0400
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
The authors of that book are using the case to advance a specific view of
the case. This is unfortunate as it does peopetuate the evil lesbian
ideology much more than the film does. IMHO the lesbian dimension is a mere
technicality that gets blown out of proportion in this repressed society.
Frankly, I find that although G & L are at the opposite end of the spectrum
to, say, the psychiatrist in HC, their view are just as off the mark.
It is an interesting angle to consider but it is far from being a
satisfactory explanation.
E. Jean Guerin
Director of Programming
FANT-ASIA Film Festival
Montreal, Canada
also: Film Critic (HOUR magazine) & Journalist (Cinefantastique)
Cult/Trash Cinema specialist (CBC-Radio's Brave New Waves)
Actor (_Heavenly Creatures_,_Frankenstein & Me_,_La Vengeance de la
Femme en Noir_)
The critics rave!
"The Most Hideous Man Alive"
-Kate Winslet, Academy Award Nominee
"Sexy Demon"
-TIME Magazine.
orson@cam.org
http://www.cam.org/~orson/index.html
==============================================================================
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n028.4 ---------------
From: "Jefferson F. Morris" <jfmorris@CapAccess.org>
Subject: Gritty realism and h...h...homo...
Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 22:00:34 -0400 (EDT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
On Thu, 16 May 1996, Donald Chin wrote:
> The other point that was critised the US introduction to the text was the
> objective portrayal of the murder. She critises the film's lack of
> embellishment during the murder scene, that the murder isn't subjectively
> shown in contrast to the way their relationship was shown (in all its
> digital wizzardry and animated sequences). He is described as abandoning
> the girls to their fate at the point. But wasn't this meant to be the
> effect?
Yes, absolutely. The film's relatively straightforward presentation of
the murder is meant to serve as a cold bucket of reality splashed in the
characters' faces. ('Straightforward' being a relative term here. Let's
just say that Mario Lanza isn't present on the soundtrack at this point, and
Diello isn't standing over Honora and sneering, 'Bloody fool.')
This is the scene where reality finally, tragically, catches up with the
girls. It's the brutal intersection of their fantasy lives with real
life (Although it's obviously more Paul's fantasy than Juliet's at this
point). Jackson's tactic is to bring us back down to earth
stylistically, while at the same time transforming the ocean liner
fantasy into a metaphorical representation of the end of Paul and
Juliet's relationship. This gives the film closure on a variety of
levels--stylistic, thematic, narrative, and emotional.
To present the murder as some kind of romantic liberation would not only
have been dramatically unsatisfying, but also rather unrealistic. These
girls weren't so far gone as to enjoy what they were doing, and to
present the scene romantically probably would have alienated the audience
irrevocably from them, which is something you obviously want to
avoid as a storyteller.
> By PJ exclaming that the relationship was a red
> herring, it allows, I think, a break in the link between lesbiansim and
> insanity/evil.
Interestingly, the first time I saw the film, the idea of the girls
being lesbians didn't even really occur to me until Dr. Bennet's
hilarious pronouncement. Of course, when they're actually in bed naked,
then I began to think, 'Hey...' But before that, I just accepted their
intimacy as a normal part of their relationship. Now there's a testimonial
to how excellent a job Jackson and Walsh did of bringing me into the girls'
world and their way of thinking.
--Jefferson
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n028.5 ---------------
From: adamabr@asterix.helix.net (Adam Abrams)
Subject: Re: First Time
Date: Wed, 15 May 1996 23:54:35 -0800
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Erica <beatles@wchat.on.ca> inscribed:
>> order the movie for my collection. Of couse, my mother thinks I'm nuts. She
>> likes the movie, but keps saying to me, "Don't murder me, Erica".
To which Tim <raven@nas.com> retorted:
>Hey... my mom says that to me too.... but my name's not Erica.
Well, my mom would make humorously suspicious references to any bricks in
my apartment (i.e. the ones holding up the stereo shelves...). I, in turn,
whenever we have a lighthearted disagreement, have been known to offer to
take her for a nice cup of tea in the park.
All in good fun, of course...
Adam "A Coupla Sick Puppies" Abrams
==========================================================================
Only the best people fight against Adam Abrams
all obstacles... in pursuit of happiness! Vancouver, BC, Canada
--Juliet Hulme, "Heavenly Creatures"
*Visit the "Fourth World" at http://www.helix.net/~adamabr/creatures.html*
==========================================================================
--------------- END heavenly-c.v001.n028 ---------------
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-------------- BEGIN heavenly-c.v001.n029 --------------
001 - Jamieson <beatles@wchat.o - Heavenly Creatures Article
002 - Sandra Bowdler <sbowdler@ - Re: Heavenly Creatures Article
003 - mailcall <mailcall@kiva.n - Re: Digest heavenly-c.v001.n028
004 - mailcall <mailcall@kiva.n - Re: Digest heavenly-c.v001.n028
005 - Bryan Woodworth <bryanw@6 - HEAVENLYWEB update
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n029.1 ---------------
From: Jamieson <beatles@wchat.on.ca>
Subject: Heavenly Creatures Article
Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 15:40:42 -0700
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hello Everyone!
I was flipping through an old issue of Interview today and <gasp!>, I found
a really great article on HC that I though you would all enjoy, if you
haven't seen it already. *Some People* might even want to post it on their
website. (Hint :) )
I think this article is "fintistic". (Is that how I say it?)
Erica
Written by Graham Fuller
Interview, November 1994
When a little girl kills, it seems like the whole world's going mad (unless,
of couse, she's played by Drew Barrymore). When a little girl kills her
mother, its as if natural law has been overturned; or it could be the most
natural impulse there is. Perhaps every female adolescent at some time
harbors a Lizzie Borden in her breast, thinking thoughts that turn Maurice
Chevaliers's lewd homily, "Fank 'eavens for leedle gurls" on its head, that
add some strychnine to "sugar and spice and everything nice," and that would
make even Humbert Humbert bat an eyelid.
Two films opening this month - one released with advance fanfare,
the other with tabloid schadenfreude - feature young girls as killers. So
far, I've seen only the trailer to Interview with the Vampire, which looks
like it'll be arch, nasty, apocolyptic fun. It ends with a close-up of
Lestat and Louis's newly vampirized child protegee, Claudia, having sucked
blood for the first time. "I want some more," she says, an original line
from Anne Rice's novel that must have had the Warner Bros. Marketing
department doing high-fives all over Burbank. As Claudia, Kirsten Dunst -
ten when she made the film - is a pale miniature Medusa with Nicole Kidman's
ringlets and some of her Malice depravity, too.
"I found her on my lap," Louis tells the interviewer in Rice's
novel, "my arms around her, feeling again how soft her skin was, like the
skin of warm fruit, plums warmed be sunlight...She was the most beautiful
child I'd ever seen, and now she glowed with the cold fire of a vampire. Her
eyes were a woman's eyes, I could see it already." Soon, the volumptuous
little horror goes on a killing spree. Claudia is an amalgram of mythic
archetypes - succubus, fallen angel, china doll - but what this femme fatale
in a child's body really represents is the male fear of the ultimate
forbidden, all the more nightmarish for being innocent. The alleged
homoeroticism in the film may yet be eclisped by its invoking of the Lolita
Syndrome.
Interview with the Vampire comes from the same school of soft gothic
as Bram Stoker's Dracula (1992): feminized, eroticized, shorn of
Expressionist dread, closer in spirit to Werner Herzog's Nosferatu the
Vampyre (1979) than F.W. Murnau's 1922 original. Sunnier still, but no less
feverish is the New Zealand gothic of Peter's Jackson's Heavenly Creatures,
based on the true story of an adolescent girl, Pauline Parker, who, in 1954,
committed matricide with the help of her English school-friend, Juliet
Hulme. The case, in its day, was a muckraking jounalist's dream. Parker and
Hulme were fantasists and soul mates who battered Parker's mother, Honora,
to death with a brick because they believed she was the impediment to their
being together. They each served five years in prison and were released on
the condition that they never see or communicate with each other again.
That might have been it, except that the screenings of Heavenly
Creatures at this year's New Zealand Film Festival led to the press leaking
Parker's[sic] identity as Anne Perry, a prolific, hugely successful
Scottish-based mystery writer. One of the hardest things I've had to watch
recently is the Today show's Jamie Gangel interviewing Perry and shamelessly
describing the murder to her, the novelist having blocked it out for forty
years. "Did you consciously use your experience?" Gangel goes on. "Not
consciously," Perry equably replies, but in book after book she has a
romantic duo - Inspector Thomas Pitt and his wife, Charlotte, or Inspector
William Monk and Nurse Hester Latterly - solving a grisly Victorian murder.
Perry's shrouded journey's back to the past look like constant revisits to
the scene of the crime, her crime, as if in search of absolution.
Heavenly Creatures depicts not only the here and now of the
obsessive friendship between poor, furtive Pauline (Melanie Lynskey) and
posh, supercilious Juliet (Kate Winslet), but also the '50s kitsch
phantasmogoria they increasingly dwell in as they feel more and more
alienated from their parents. Juliet's father is a repressed, desiccated
doctor; her mother a therapist who has affairs with her more rugged
patients. Pauline's father is a buffoon; her mother, the doomed woman, a
careworn but well-meaning scold. Faced with such coldness or mediocrity,
many teenage girls of the time must have fantasized Mario Lanza and James
Mason into their adventures or conjured up Orson Welles as a bogeyman, as
Pauline and Juliet do. But their are hints of cruelty and aberration in this
pair's dreaming. "Borovnia," the magical medieval kingdom of the "novel"
they write, is more than a lost Eden of unicorns, giant butterflies, and
morphing gardens; it's a site of sexual delirium, where Juliet's clay models
of kings, queens, and courtiers grow to life size and roll around in an orgy.
Jackson's direction is as hyperactive as the imaginations it
inhabits; he can't keep his camera still and he has a kid-in-a-candy-store
approach to lighting and color, opening the film with faded travelogue
footage of Christchurch, bleaching out the screen here, bathing it in gold
there, connoting wild teen emotions through a battery of tinctures and
styles. But he knows when to get brutally naturalistic. When Pauline and
Juliet lead Honora (Sarah Peirse) down a winding mud path in a public park -
the homely, middle-aged woman smiling at the simple pleasure of a day out -
and then start to bludgeon her on the head, the perverse fairy-tale ambiance
of the movie turns malignent and squalid. The scene is reminiscent of the
park killing of Lane (Marcia Gay Harden) in Alison MacLean's Crush (1992),
which also dealt with feral female energies in "God's own country."
Heavenly Creatures' true analogue, though, is Fun, Rafal Zielinski's
dangerous study of two bright, abused L.A. coeds who stab an old woman to
death on an afternoon's jaunt. Screened at this year's Sundance Film
Festival, it has sadly failed to find a distibutor. Maybe it's that girl
killers in movies need the sanction of the past to be palatable. Or maybe
someone in a high place thought Fun should be withheld in case Chelsea
Clinton saw it and began to get ideas.
???????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
???????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n029.2 ---------------
From: Sandra Bowdler <sbowdler@uniwa.uwa.edu.au>
Subject: Re: Heavenly Creatures Article
Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 11:05:38 +0800 (WST)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
Hello all,
...and especially Erica, many thanks for the article.
I think the closest rendition would be "fentestuc".
cheers
sb
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n029.3 ---------------
From: mailcall <mailcall@kiva.net>
Subject: Re: Digest heavenly-c.v001.n028
Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 05:50:19 -0500 (EST)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
: The introduction by B. Ruby Rich critised the film for two points.
: One was the folie a deux portrayal of the girl's relationship -
: that it led to the murder. Maybe she felt that this just parallels
: the view that the mass media and the court trial gave of the case -
: that the girls were either "bad" or "mad".
(haven't read g&l yet, it's waitin' for me down at the library)
i noticed particularly that in the film, they decided on the moider in an
almost afterthoughty way, as if they could have chosen to do just about
anything, or moider just about anybody (except the real villain of the
film, julie's dad.)
now, this is the conclusion a person like rich might come to if she's only
seen the film once or twice, and hasn't taken the time as we have to read
between the lines, notice the subtleties, and possibly dip into the holy
scriptures (why do i keep calling them that?).
also, dr porter told me that the "afterthoughty" aspect of the film's
approach to the moider is a reflection of the way people at the time felt
about the case. it was seen by a lot of people as a thrill-killing like
leopold and what's his name, to which it was much compared at the time.
==
ow! the evil prince ganymede's escaping!!
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n029.4 ---------------
From: mailcall <mailcall@kiva.net>
Subject: Re: Digest heavenly-c.v001.n028
Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 06:10:53 -0500 (EST)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
: Well, my mom would make humorously suspicious references to any
: bricks in my apartment (i.e. the ones holding up the stereo
: shelves...). I, in turn, whenever we have a lighthearted
: disagreement, have been known to offer to take her for a nice cup
: of tea in the park.
snicker! i couldn't even bring it up with my mum. when she asked me what's
the film about, i gave her a very brief outline, ending with "there were a
lot of misunderstandings, and somebody got killed."
my mum's opinion was that this would be a lot better world if would-be
do-gooders would just mind their own business and let people alone. she
had just seen some stuff on television where "dungeons and dragons" is
still being played up as causing insanity, suicide, and god knows what all
else. i think she gets the picture. :)
i also told her that if she ever ran out of agatha christies to read, she
should start on anne perry.
*--==--==--*love is real*--==--*imagine*--==--==--*remember*--==--==--*
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n029.5 ---------------
From: Bryan Woodworth <bryanw@666.org>
Subject: HEAVENLYWEB update
Date: Fri, 17 May 1996 05:39:23 -0700 (PDT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Length: 1606
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Dear Subscribers,
I'm sorry for not updating the site earlier! I've been distracted with
the computer issue. I now have a new computer, which works quite well.
Thank you all for your patience. (It's a bit of twisted humor that John
Argentiero's computer broke, then mine.. hmm!)
NEW ADDITIONS:
o Another picture of Pauline, from the movie, by Marco Thorbruegge!
Thanks Marco!
o The Guest Book ("Chat Zone") has been split into smaller
sections. No longer need one wait for 70K of data to load..
The main section is quite small, with the old entries a
single click away.
o Archives of the HC Mailing List are now online in the Mailing list
section of HeavenlyWeb, in textfile ("on-line reading") or ZIP
(off-line reading) formats.
o The HC Art Gallery is now open! This area is dedicated to those
who wish to express their adulation for Heavenly Creatures via
the powerful medium of graphic art. Please submit your
contributions to me, for prompt addition to this section!
There are already two submissions (one by me, not very
impressive, but spooky nonetheless!) -- have a look.
I believe that was all that was due for this week -- if I forgot
something, please remind me. I am still catching up on email as well.
Thank you for your support! Enjoy the list and HeavenlyWeb.
Best regards,
Bryan Woodworth
Moderator
Heavenly Creatures Mailing List
--
"'Tis indeed a miracle, one must feel,
that two such heavenly creatures are real." bryan woodworth
-- "Heavenly Creatures," 1994 bryanw@borovnia.666.org
http://www.reflection.org/heavenly/
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-------------- BEGIN heavenly-c.v001.n030 --------------
001 - orson@cam.org (Jean Gueri - PICS!!!!!
002 - Bao Ly <lybao@earthlink.n - [Fwd: ] Film Quarterly Fall 1995
003 - Thaiphong Vo <thaivo@ea.o - Hi everyone..
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n030.1 ---------------
From: orson@cam.org (Jean Guerin)
Subject: PICS!!!!!
Date: Thu, 16 May 1996 21:22:04 -0400
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hi Everybody!
Spring has sprung
My page has riz
No need to wonder where my pics is.
Visit the updated "Most Hideous Page on the Web"
Note to Adam, Brian and all who link to my page:
You can link to it but I'd like to keep it exclusive for now- thanx!
Hideously yours,
E. Jean Guerin
Director of Programming
FANT-ASIA Film Festival
Montreal, Canada
also: Film Critic (HOUR magazine) & Journalist (Cinefantastique)
Cult/Trash Cinema specialist (CBC-Radio's Brave New Waves)
Actor (_Heavenly Creatures_,_Frankenstein & Me_,_La Vengeance de la
Femme en Noir_)
The critics rave!
"The Most Hideous Man Alive"
-Kate Winslet, Academy Award Nominee
"Sexy Demon"
-TIME Magazine.
orson@cam.org
http://www.cam.org/~orson/index.html
==============================================================================
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n030.2 ---------------
From: Bao Ly <lybao@earthlink.net>
Subject: [Fwd: ] Film Quarterly Fall 1995
Date: Sat, 18 May 1996 17:54:13 -0700
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I believe someone requested a text-version of the Film Quarterly Fall 1995
article on
HeavenlyWeb? Sorry for the delay...
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Film Quarterly Fall 1995, v49, n1, p33(6) =
=20
Heavenly Creatures. (movie reviews) =
=20
(Screen Pages: 1-23) Document Page 1
Director: Peter Jackson. Screenplay: Franceswaish and Peter Jackson.
Miramax.=20
The 1950s, Christchurch, New Zealand. An era and place that conjure up
an atmosphere of stifling Anglican propriety and reserve. On a cold
late June day in 1954, teenagers Pauline Parker and Juliet Hulme
dashed the serenity of that image by bludgeoning to death Pauline's
mother, Honora Rieper, with a brick as the three walked through
Victoria Park. Why Parker and Hulme felt driven to commit what became
one of New Zealand's most scandalous crimes is vividly recounted in
the film Heavenly Creatures (1994), written by Frances Walsh and Peter
Jackson and directed by Jackson. The film's exuberant style and humor
belie its equally serious and deeply disturbing tone that is weirdly
empathic to the girls while paradoxically never undercutting the
brutal nature of their crime. By turns comic, tragic, fantastic, and
romantic, the film, much like its true-life source, defies simple
interpretation, yet leads inescapably to an unsettling awareness of a
guilt rarely untouched by innocence and an innocence not untainted by
some degree of guilt.=20
Jackson and Walsh based their screenplay on transcripts and
psychiatric reports from the Parker/Hulme murder trial, interviews
with the girls' classmates, and the diaries from 1953 and 1954 of
Pauline Parker. Jackson has indicated that he and Walsh were
particularly drawn to and influenced by the girls' own witty and
irreverent humor as evidenced in Parker's diaries, which were quoted
liberally at the trial and which serve as voice-over material
throughout the film.(1) Although publicity for the film brought to
light the identity of Juliet Hulme (changed after her release from
prison in 1959) as mystery writer Anne Perry, Jackson and Walsh avoid
all mention of the fact in the film and did not attempt to contact
Hulme/Perry in the course of their research or after the film's
release. Jackson, whose previous work includes the gory cult favorite
Braindead (U.S.: Dead Alive, 1993), is aided by his fascination for
the inexplicable and grotesque, plunging viewers into a visually vivid
world of adolescent imagination, racing along with Pauline and
Juliet's sweeping fantasies into sand castles and fanciful kingdoms.
Jackson and Walsh temper these audacious visual extremes with an
abstruse quality by framing the girls' relationship within
distinctively religious parameters and a sense of immutable destiny
that characterize their association as a reach for the sublime and
mark their fall as all the more tragic. Jackson and Walsh play up this
fateful sensibility with thematic and dramatic devices that shape the
ties between the Riepers and the Hulmes into a mythical bond.(2) In
one of several self-reflexive moments, Pauline remarks about an opera
she is writing, describing it as "a three act story with a tragic
end," thereby punctuating Jackson and Walsh's structure as mirroring
that of the classic tragedy. The bare facts of the tragedy are that
teenage outcasts Pauline Parker and Juliet Hulme meet in school, are
drawn together by mutual childhood illnesses, become extraordinarily
devoted to one another, so much so that when their respective parents
grow concerned and try to separate them they become desperate enough
to murder Pauline's mother, whom they perceive to be the major
obstacle to their remaining together. Jackson, in a radical departure
from New Zealand's legendary view of Parker and Hulme as monstrous
deviants, calls their tale "=D4a=E4 murder story about love. A murder
story with no villains."(3)=20
Pauline Parker and Juliet Hulme are literally in continual flight from
their respective fates, Pauline (Melanie Lynskey) from a despised,
dull, working-class background and unremarkable parents (Honora and
Herbert Rieper, played by Sarah Pierse and Simon O'Connor), Juliet
(Kate Winslet) from ill health, careless parents (Hilda and Herbert
Hulme, played by Diana Kent and Clive Merrison) and repeated periods
of abandonment. Jackson and Walsh intimate that disaster is brought
about not so much by the girls' avoidance of destiny as by their
determination to shape it themselves. Juliet's own definition of
heaven, "a paradise of music, art, and pure enjoyment," fashions the
narrative arc, with the girls' constant imaginative creativity
implicated as a major source of their undoing. Although the murder of
Honora Rieper is depicted as the nightmarish calamity it indeed was,
there is no doubt that an equal part of the horror of the story lies
in the unaccustomed positioning of desire and determination in the
hands of two adolescent females. The deceptively mild, even playful
tampering with gender, class, and age expectations delineated in the
film gives an added twist to the odd symbiosis of the sullen,
introverted Pauline and the precocious, extroverted Juliet, and
unexpectedly provides much of the discomfiture about their association
and raises germane questions of past and continuing expectations of
gender, especially female, roles.=20
Although Heavenly Creatures explores both girls' lives two years
before, up to, and including the murder, ultimately the film
concentrates on Pauline's story and her unique tragedy. Surrounded by
identically guileless classmates and implacable teachers at school,
and overly solicitous parents and insipid male boarders at home,
Pauline is emblematic of the Flaubertian heroine in her longing to
escape to a world of romance. She is mortified by her family's
working-class background, her gregariously simple fish store manager
father, and her unimaginatively practical mother who takes in
boarders. Jackson parallels the Rieper's homelife and the staid,
pragmatic qualities of Christchurch with such disarming (if droll)
ingenuousness that they immediately assume the loathsome blandness
discerned by the restless Pauline. When pitched next to Juliet's
vivaciousness, posh home, and glamorous parents, Pauline's
dissatisfactions and romantic hopes appear palpable.=20
While a common enough predilection, what makes Pauline's discontent
unusual is her seeking salvation so fiercely through Juliet. What
might otherwise be neatly categorized as a normal, if perhaps hyper,
extension of a passing phase of the tumultuous extremes of adolescence
in this instance amazingly unfolds instead into matricide. Jackson's
running fantasy motif of Pauline happily chasing Juliet across a
cruise-liner deck toward Hilda and Henry Hulme perfectly captures
Pauline's yearning for/to be Juliet, as well as her wish for the
autonomy of the upper-class and the proper family who could provide
her with that ideal. Pauline is constantly shown throughout the film
in literal pursuit of Juliet (significantly reversed in the walk
through Victoria Park). Jackson's near obsessive focus on legs and
feet suggests an attempt by the characters to find a bearing, to
direct a mercurial fate that eventually proves beyond even Pauline and
Juliet's most determined retreats. Juliet, as Pauline's link to this
dream, is consequently placed, by her own supreme confidence and
Pauline's fervent loyalty (traditionally masculine values), in a
position of preeminence rarely allotted women and for which, not
surprisingly, she and Pauline--and, tragically, Honora Rieper--will
suffer. The consequence, blithely but knowingly painted by the
film-makers, is that acumen, desire, and the feminine are an
inherently dangerous mix.=20
The film's lingering and often irreverently humorous religious tone,
meant to echo the girls' gradually prospering view of themselves as
indeed superior "heavenly creatures," is built upon their constant
association with creativity and art (the two meet in art class).
Pauline and Juliet's drawing, sculpting, writing, and musical
proclivities are interwoven into the narrative diegetically and
nondiegetically in impressive fashion, with perhaps the strongest
empathic tone gained through an astute use of music, associated with
the spiritual and emotional. Peter Dasent's mesmerizing original score
is augmented by Jackson's shrewd employment of prerecorded music, the
importance of which is emphasized by its actual reference in the
script.(4) In the initial musical motif, the framing reference of the
divine is established under the opening titles with a girls choir's
crisply enunciated rendering of the hymn "Just a Closer Walk with
Thee." The hymn's lyric foreshadows Pauline and Juliet's association,
emphasizing a strong element of longing: "Just a closer walk with
thee, grant if Jesus, it's my plea, daily walking close to thee, let
it be, dear Lord, let it be ..."=20
The virtuous tone of the ongoing hymn is contrasted with the pointedly
physical introduction to Pauline. The red (danger?) school door is
matched by a pan across a clothes-filled clothesline to the red door
of a small cottage, which opens to reveal a schoolgirl's coat and
skirt hiked up, exposing a thigh and gloved hands pulling up hose to a
garter belt before the girl hastens off to join the throng of students
heading to school. The emphasis on the corporeal immediately connects
Pauline with the erotic and also with death, as a hose stocking will
cover the brick used to kill Mrs. Rieper. Combined with the
reverential mood set up by the hymn (significantly intoning "Thro'
this world of toil and snares ... who with me by burden shares?"),
Pauline is established within a distinctly religious parameter of
yearning and, further, within a traditional Christian definition, of
seeking life through death (the ultimate object of desire). Her
ripeness for "conversion" is underscored as, sullenly silent amongst
her booming classmates, Pauline is eyed by an ever-vigilant teacher
and then hastily mutters the last line to the hymn, the markedly
supplicate words, "let it be." "It" arrives immediately thereafter, in
the form of the supercilious Juliet. As the coolly British Juliet is
introduced to Pauline and the class, the girls choir is just barely
discernible, angelically, in the background, connecting her with the
divine, a literal answer to Pauline's prayer.=20
A more blatant if distinctive musical motif is established with the
boisterous tunes of Juliet's idol, Mario Lanza, whose resonant style
captures her somewhat manic energy, while also serving as a
(humorously campy) link to her insistence on seeking refuge within
romantic fantasy. Lanza's singing comes across as antiseptic "pop
opera," particularly in contrast with the poignancy of the Puccini
arias used in the darker second half of the film. Amusingly, Lanza is
the first and most significant of the girls' self-ordained "saints,"
and the only figure to traverse between their customized version of
paradise, the "fourth world" ("It's sort of like heaven--only better,
because there aren't any Christians"), and their more licentious
fantasy kingdom (described in a jointly written novel), Borovnia. As
such, Lanza literally functions as the primary mediating symbol
displacing the girls' burgeoning desire, yet is always held in the
realm of the emotional and romantic, in direct contrast to his
opposite "cast out" saint, discussed below.=20
Lanza and his enthusiastically rendered melodies also serve as a
barometer of Pauline's emotions, in the girl's initial captivation
with Juliet (prophetically, with "Be My Love"), in her uncertainty
over Juliet's flights of fancy (swept aside when Juliet propels a
startled Pauline into her own ebullience by whisking her off to "The
Donkey Serenade"), and in Pauline and Juliet's eventual romantic
consummation ("The Loveliest Night of the Year"). Significantly, once
the girls commit to their plan to murder Honora Rieper, they bum all
their Lanza records, indicating a complete break with the world of
enchantment. Lanza's return over the end credits with "You'll Never
Walk Alone" provides a powerful backdrop that elicits a particularly
ironic pathos after the desolation of the final scenes.=20
The obvious correlation between musical excess and Pauline and
Juliet's emotions is paralleled by the connection between their more
tangible artistic pursuits of writing, drawing, and sculpting as
further displacements of their simultaneously mounting mutual
self-absorption and familial frustrations. This culminates with a
startling joint creation of darker consequence, that Jackson and Walsh
again fix against a religiously ritualistic backdrop. When Juliet
ordains pictures of (exclusively male) film stars as fourth world
"saints" one night at a homemade brick altar, renaming them ("He,"
"Him," "This," "That"), Pauline offers her own "saint," Orson Welles,
declaring him "It." Juliet hurls away the picture ("Absolutely not!
Orson Welles--the most hideous man alive!"), then immediately grasps
the startled if still enraptured Pauline by the hands to give praise
to her preferred saints. Juliet's attempts to fling away the
unmanageable reality of desire, incorporated in the "hideous"
It--Jackson and Walsh's transparent but shrewd allusion to the
Id--with a more aesthetic, if egocentric illusion, denies her literal
clinging to It in the form of Pauline. The use of Welles, as the
darker "outcast saint," delightfully plays upon his wunderkind
reputation as well as his cinematic image as the mysterious, complex,
sinister, and very often outside the law rogue, whose most famous
role, not uncoincidentally, involves the loss of maternal love. The
shot of the dismissed picture of Welles floating down the stream
before being swept over a tiny fall, as ominous music swells, suggest
that It/desire will not be long denied. Shrouded within the humor of
the scene is the uneasy but clear reinforcement of the combination of
ego and desire in the feminine as unnatural and unpredictable.=20
This notion is made even clearer with the girls' vision of the fourth
world (prompted by the Hulmes' decision to go abroad for a lengthy
stay, without Juliet), realized through morphing effects, described by
Pauline's diary entries in voice-over as distinctly edenesque ("full
of peace and bliss"), righteously exclusive "only ten people have =D4the
key=E4"), and pointedly anti-christian ("we only recognized it on the
day of the death of Christ"). Emphasizing this moment of genesis, the
sequence immediately following has Pauline and Juliet assuming the
identities of Borovnian royalty, Charles and Deborah, and hilariously
enacting the birth of Charles/Pauline and Deborah/Juliet's
"heir"--Diello. Diello's literal appearance, first as a tiny clay
figurine, then as a lifesize one with distinctly Wellesian features
that reveal his identity as It, is immediately connected with excess.
Juliet's abrupt recurrence of tuberculosis and four-month quarantine
and the girls' resulting frustration at separation prompts Diello's
emergence in Pauline and Juliet's daily exchange of letters. The royal
heir goes on imaginary, if vivid, killing rampages "to alleviate
(Pauline's) boredom (of the dull lower classes)," and to dispense with
vexatious adults, such as the sanctimonious minister ("Jesus Loves
You") who comes to visit Juliet at the sanitarium and the clumsy
doctor ("Do you like your mother?") to whom the Riepers eventually
take Pauline. With the conception of Diello the ecstatic exuberance of
the Lanza-inspired cavortings and whimsical fantasy of the
celestialized fourth world give way to a more ominous indication of
desire spinning out of control and, more disquietingly, to the growing
regard of the girls for violence as a potential solution to ward off
unpleasant realities. This reversal of conventional female prodigality
is unsettling in its inference that the only possible outcome of any
union between women is horror, excess, and death. Yet Jackson and
Walsh's somewhat dark intimations do not lead inexorably to matricide,
serving instead as provocative endeavors at interpreting the
unfathomable depth and complexities of Pauline and Juliet's
involvement and their remarkable inwardlooking capacity for
self-fulfillment.=20
Themes of transformation and rebirth are suggested by the multiple
names given Pauline throughout the film (significantly, the two
holidays mentioned in the film are religious and mirror these themes:
Christmas/birth, when Pauline gets her diaries, and Easter/rebirth
through death at Port Levy where the girls have their "revelation" of
the fourth world). Pauline's family, John the boarder, and Dr. Bennett
use her middle name, Yvonne. To schoolmates, teachers, and the Hulmes
she is Pauline Rieper. Juliet calls her Paul, then Charles, and
finally Gina, a Borovnian gypsy clay figurine that Pauline tells John
is Juliet's creation. Only as Gina does Pauline find satisfaction,
however fleeting. The film's undercurrent of Juliet as the focus of
desire, as "divine," and Pauline as her pliant "disciple" seeking
salvation and transformation, is stressed as Pauline refers to herself
for the remainder of the film as Gina--as does Juliet. Even in the
closing moments of the film, with the grisly murder intercut with
Juliet on the fantasy cruise ship pulling away and Pauline trapped on
the pier, Juliet calls out to Pauline as Gina. Juliet's last words,
"I'm sorry," seem an apology for her ultimate inability to sustain the
girts' shared paradisiacal delusions and for in fact destroying all
their creations, primarily Pauline herself.=20
However persuasive the film-makers are at weaving a weird if uneasy
empathy for Pauline and Juliet's exhilarating alliance, they carefully
refrain from demonizing the girls' parents (if not the other adults in
the film, who are waggishly presented exclusively from the girls'
point of view). The Hulmes are initially bemused, the Riepers confused
by Pauline and Juliet's intense mutual devotion, seemingly never fully
aware of how their own ordinary deficiencies drive the girls ever
closer. Jackson and Walsh characterize the Hulmes' growing domestic
misfortunes in a sensitive if sparse manner, focusing more harshly on
Henry's trepidation over the fervor of Juliet and Pauline's
friendship. Henry's anxiety easily mirrors that of the patriarchal
social milieu of the decade, scandalized at impermeable,
uncontrollable feminine excess. Both the Riepers' and the Hulmes'
inability to grasp the magnitude of their respective daughter's
individual and combined alienation and emotional needs decidedly
propels the situation towards catastrophe.=20
Honora Rieper especially finds her daughter's emotional withdrawal and
hostility incomprehensible, as is made apparent by her completely
guileless response to Dr. Bennett's declaration that Pauline may be
(in his terms) homosexual: "But she's always been a normal, happy
child." Honora Rieper encroaches on hallowed ground. Juliet's
excessive longing for dependable, unwavering parental love and
Pauline's absolute rejection of her own parents as deficient creates a
tremendous emotional void the girls fill with a frighteningly powerful
faith in each other which leaves no room for their hapless parents.
Rather than a crime of passion, Honora's murder becomes a crime for
passion, a sacrificial act binding Pauline and Juliet together
forever, a reach for the exaltation of mutual faith that ends in
damnation with their shattering the most sacred of taboos, matricide.
The film falters slightly in bridging the gap between Pauline and
Juliet's leap from emotional desperation at the threat of separation
(the Hulmes' breakup precipitating Juliet's relocation to South
Africa) to murder. Juliet's enforced separation from Pauline as the
latter's homelife crumbles is confused, although the final musical
shift to opera stabilizes some of these choppier sections, recalling
the theme of mythical and unalterable predetermination. Forbidden to
see Juliet, a despondent Pauline considers suicide ("Life seems so
much not worth living") as "E lucevan le stelle" from Tosca plays on
her phonograph ("My dream of love is now destroyed forever, my hour is
fleeting and I must die despairing!"). The sense of immutable destiny
is augmented by the narrative rupture of Juliet's poignant a cappella
rendering of "Sono andati" from La Boheme after she agrees to help
Pauline murder Honora. Significantly, the fantasy cruise-liner
sequence is completed during this scene, as Pauline and Juliet,
calling "Mummy," rush into the welcoming embrace of Henry and Hilda,
connecting sacrifice/death with fulfillment. The operatic motif is
concluded by Pauline, Honora, and Juliet's "last supper" and their
fateful walk in Victoria Park to Puccini's haunting "Humming Chorus."
The extravagance linked with opera is indicative of detirium, yet
given the somberness of the pieces utilized, it promotes a bleaker
tone in sharp contrast to the earlier ebullience of the Lanza music.
The musical sense of threatening delirium is articulated when Pauline
tells Juliet as the two sit in the bathtub together, "I think I'm
going crazy." Juliet (significantly up to her neck in water) replies,
"No you're not, Gina, it's everyone else who's bonkers." In her diary
Pauline claims she and Juliet must be mad, as are the saints and even
Henry Hulme, which asserts-breaking somewhat with the narrative's
constant insinuation of female desire as insanity--that as reality
around them sinks into madness they have no choice but to respond in
kind. This implicates the girls' surrounding circumstance as at least
partially responsible for the coming disaster, reiterates the
preordained theme, and subtly insists that female madness is indeed a
constructed designation.=20
The link between feminine desire and madness is reestablished with the
film's climax. Parker's diary indicates a sexual relationship with
Hulme ("We enacted how each saint would make love . . . . It was
wonderful, heavenly, beautiful and ours . . . . We have learned the
peace of the thing called bliss, the joy of the thing called sin")
that Jackson and Walsh artfully and touchingly translate to the
screen, fulfilling the augur of Orson Welles/It as the surrogate of
desire. Nevertheless, in discussing the film's lesbian content,
Jackson states he believes the issue is something of a "red
herring,"(5) despite his own heavily romanticized construction of
Pauline and Juliet's relationship. Psychiatric reports given at the
trial are contradictory in reaching a conclusion as to whether or not
the girls did indeed have a physical relationship, although
homosexuality, then categorized as a mental illness, was part of the
girls' unsuccessful insanity defense. Jackson's veiled implications
that the girls were merely playing out conventional romantic fantasies
disregards the fact that they would have had little else but
heterosexual prototypes against which to play out nascent longings,
lesbian or otherwise. The linking of lesbianism and mental illness
falls into a similar psychological tendency of associating any
powerful feminine drive with the unnatural and the problematic and
therefore needful of a "cure." Placing the girls' romantic fulfillment
immediately before their decision to murder Honora completes the
connection of sex and death, while stressing their own revered desire
to be united on a higher, inviolate plane.=20
Heavenly Creatures is a startling, brilliantly rendered love story of
faith and loyalty that was misguided and misunderstood in its own era
perhaps as much as today. Pauline Parker and Juliet Hulme, each
catalogued as outsider, as other, dared to find and believe in the
grandeur of their difference. Their overwhelming, ferocious emotional
unity was both audacious and terrifying in its dimensions. Film-maker
Peter Jackson and co-screenwriter Frances Walsh rise to the bizarre
and dazzling demands of portraying Parker and Hulme's relationship as
one that is as peculiarly admirable and touching as it is horrifying.
It remains one of the strongest of the all too infrequent cinematic
representations of women's interrelationships as capable of passion,
intelligence, and fidelity, basking in rather than condemning the
extremes of distinctive feminine emotional possibilities, and
hauntingly tragic in its revelation of the depth of human frailties
when attempting to reach beyond the sublime.=20
Luisa F. Ribeiro is completing her M.A. in the School of
Cinema-Television at the University of Southern California.=20
Notes=20
(1.) Interview with Peter Jackson and Francis Walsh by Terry Gross;
"Fresh Air," National Public Radio, December 22, 1994. (2.) An end
title explains Honora and Herbert Rieper were never legally married
and so Pauline was charged under her mother's maiden name of Parker.
(3.) Heavenly Creatures press notes. (4.) A draft of the screenplay
indicates scenes were always built around the use of specific Mario
Lanza songs. Jackson and Walsh were guided in their musical selections
by Parker's own stated preferences in diary entries mentioning Tosca
and psychiatric reports that state one of her novels was entitled The
Donkey's Serenade. (5.) Gemma Files, "Those Difficult, Murderous
Teenage Years," Eye Weekly, January 19, 1995, Toronto, Ontario.=20
REQUESTED BY: ly TIME/DATE: 12:06:43 18 MAY 1996
TOTAL COST: $0.00 SOURCE: Magazine Index
COPYRIGHT 1996, Information Access Co., ALL RIGHTS RESERVED.
--------------751D5B9B5471--
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n030.3 ---------------
From: Thaiphong Vo <thaivo@ea.oac.uci.edu>
Subject: Hi everyone..
Date: Sat, 18 May 1996 17:55:19 -0700 (PDT)
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hello everyone, : )
Looks like I've missed quite a bit of discussion.. I failed in my first
attempt at adding the list.. then forgot for a week.. : (
To introduce myself, I've just turned twenty and attend the University of
California at Irvine. I've been a HC freak since last summer when I rented
the video from a small videostore across the street. It was the first movie
I've seen that screamed out for a second, then a third consecutive viewing.
One of the great things was the fact that I didn't know what to expect from
the movie... I had seen advertisements for it's theatrical release, but knew
little else (I'm still kicking myself for not seeing it in a theater!). At
first I was extremely perplexed when I saw the archival footage. I thought
I had made some terrible blunder, but before any real dissapointment set in
the screams of Pauline and Juliet took my breath away. It's hard to
describe the amount of joy and horror the movie sent me through on the first
viewing. Nothing has, and I doubt everwill compare to the experience.
A few months later I say Sense & Sensibilty, and I have to admit an
embarrassing fact. I didn't recognize Kate until the movie was nearly over!
I think I embarrassed my friend I was sitting with, and bothered people in a
five people radius when I finally realized. "Oh my GOD!", the comment
didn't make any sense in context to movie, so people did turn their heads. :
)
Well, I'm up to my 20th viewing now, and it's still pretty wonderful.
I'm just waiting for Melanie to come out of her hiatus and grace the world
once more.. I'll be first in line!
Hope to have really great discussions in the future with all you guys,
it's great to find others that love th movie also.
Btw, I'm hoping to have my "Melanie Lynskey : The One I Worship" page up
sometime in late June.. I'm also hoping there's much more to write about
Melanie by then too.
Take care,
-Thai
------------=========================----------------------
I worship the power of these lovely two [Thaiphong Vo ]
With that adoring love known to so few. <thaivo@ea.uci.edu>
'Tis indeed a miracle, one must feel,
That two such heavenly creatures are real.
. . .And these wonderful people are you and I.
-Pauline Yvonne Parker ~1953
"The Ones That I Worship"
----------------=======================------------------------
--------------- END heavenly-c.v001.n030 ---------------
From heavenly-c-errors@lists1.best.com Sun May 19 21:44:13 1996
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Date: Sun, 19 May 1996 21:43:42 -0700
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Subject: Digest heavenly-c.v001.n031
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-------------- BEGIN heavenly-c.v001.n031 --------------
001 - Donald Chin <donaldc@nets - Broken link on Hideous page...
002 - Donald Chin <donaldc@nets - Glamuzina and Laurie...
003 - "Jefferson F. Morris" <jf - Welcoming a newcomer...and a delicate question
004 - orson@cam.org (Jean Gueri - Re: Welcoming a newcomer...and a delicate question
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n031.1 ---------------
From: Donald Chin <donaldc@netspace.net.au>
Subject: Broken link on Hideous page...
Date: Sun, 19 May 1996 14:37:55 +1000
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hi
I just visited the Jean's fabulous page. The pictures are just wonderful.
However, there is a broken link. The image Jean2.jpeg couldn't be found. It
is the screen test picture of Orson.
Regards
Donald
--
Donald Chin <donaldc@netspace.net.au>
"Lost somewhere in Australia...
and fanatical about Heavenly Creatures and Jane Austen!"
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n031.2 ---------------
From: Donald Chin <donaldc@netspace.net.au>
Subject: Glamuzina and Laurie...
Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 00:55:19 +1000
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hi all,
Anybody here on the list know if the hard back version of the book is any
different from the paperback version. I have the Firebrand paper back.
Someone told me that there may be extra photos in the hard back version.
Thanks for any help.
Regards
Donald
--
Donald Chin <donaldc@netspace.net.au>
"Lost somewhere in Australia...
and fanatical about Heavenly Creatures and Jane Austen!"
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n031.3 ---------------
From: "Jefferson F. Morris" <jfmorris@CapAccess.org>
Subject: Welcoming a newcomer...and a delicate question
Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 00:12:09 -0400 (EDT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
On Sat, 18 May 1996, Thaiphong Vo wrote:
> Hello everyone, : )
Hello back, young feller.
> A few months later I say Sense & Sensibilty, and I have to admit an
> embarrassing fact. I didn't recognize Kate until the movie was nearly over!
Damn, that is embarrassing. Kate was the main reason I saw S&S. I was
swooning like Dante from her first appearance.
> Well, I'm up to my 20th viewing now, and it's still pretty wonderful.
> I'm just waiting for Melanie to come out of her hiatus and grace the world
> once more.. I'll be first in line!
Join the club. Well...I guess you have.
> Btw, I'm hoping to have my "Melanie Lynskey : The One I Worship" page up
> sometime in late June..
Looks like you'll get along just fine with our moderator. As long as you
guys don't get into some heavy competition or anything.
Anyhow, welcome.
--Jefferson
P.S. You know...I've been wondering about this for a while.
What's "Up the duff?" I feel 8 and a half and incredibly stupid. I've
narrowed it down to two things.
1) Pregnant. (Likely)
2) Sodomized. (Less likely)
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n031.4 ---------------
From: orson@cam.org (Jean Guerin)
Subject: Re: Welcoming a newcomer...and a delicate question
Date: Sun, 19 May 1996 00:45:50 -0400
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>1) Pregnant. (Likely)
it's an old expression in nz
EJG
--------------- END heavenly-c.v001.n031 ---------------
From heavenly-c-errors@lists1.best.com Mon May 20 23:04:28 1996
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Subject: Digest heavenly-c.v001.n032
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-------------- BEGIN heavenly-c.v001.n032 --------------
001 - Thaiphong Vo <thaivo@ea.o - Re: Welcoming a newcomer...and a delicate question
002 - mailcall <mailcall@kiva.n - Re: Digest heavenly-c.v001.n031
003 - Bryan Woodworth <bryanw@6 - Canterbury Public Library
004 - Sandra Bowdler <sbowdler@ - Re: Canterbury Public Library
005 - Michael Chin <mktchin@cos - Up the duff
006 - Sandra Bowdler <sbowdler@ - ABC Broadcast
007 - Erica Jamieson <beatles@w - Re: Up the duff
008 - Sandra Bowdler <sbowdler@ - ABC Broadcast - oops
009 - kate ann jacobson <kjac@u - the birth of a cushion
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n032.1 ---------------
From: Thaiphong Vo <thaivo@ea.oac.uci.edu>
Subject: Re: Welcoming a newcomer...and a delicate question
Date: Sun, 19 May 1996 22:39:00 -0700 (PDT)
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>Hello back, young feller.
: )
>Damn, that is embarrassing. Kate was the main reason I saw S&S. I was
>swooning like Dante from her first appearance.
When I saw it a second time though she had my total attention. I was
completely amazed by her performance. Also loved her voice.
>Join the club. Well...I guess you have.
We should start calling ourselves a club, or something. Like the
Heavenliphiles..: ) I'm giddy just thinking about all the jargon I could
come up with.
>> Btw, I'm hoping to have my "Melanie Lynskey : The One I Worship" page up
>> sometime in late June..
>
>Looks like you'll get along just fine with our moderator. As long as you
>guys don't get into some heavy competition or anything.
: ) Actually, it's a novel.. And we'll be sending of to New York...
Actually me and Bryan have been getting along pretty well, : )
I'm quite envious of his letter from Melanie..
>Anyhow, welcome.
Thanks!
>P.S. You know...I've been wondering about this for a while.
>
>What's "Up the duff?" I feel 8 and a half and incredibly stupid. I've
>narrowed it down to two things.
>1) Pregnant. (Likely)
>2) Sodomized. (Less likely)
I think Jean answered this, I had thought it just meant having
intercourse. I didn't know it meant getting pregnant. Any opinions?
-Thai
------------=========================----------------------
I worship the power of these lovely two [Thaiphong Vo ]
With that adoring love known to so few. <thaivo@ea.uci.edu>
'Tis indeed a miracle, one must feel,
That two such heavenly creatures are real.
. . .And these wonderful people are you and I.
-Pauline Yvonne Parker ~1953
"The Ones That I Worship"
----------------=======================------------------------
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n032.2 ---------------
From: mailcall <mailcall@kiva.net>
Subject: Re: Digest heavenly-c.v001.n031
Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 00:44:14 -0500 (EST)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
yes, "up the duff" = pregnant. that was how they got the idea for diello.
first, juliet said "i bet she gets up the duff on their first night
together." immediately thereafter, jonsy, frustrated that he didn't get to
hear what "up the duff" meant, charged juliet and destroyed the castle.
jonsy was always jumping on the girls, knocking them down, whacking them
in the butt (the evil prince ganymede) and he broke paul's record too. i
think the idea for a child who commits wholesale destruction and insists
on "coming along" to executions originated with jonsy. in the film, that
is, i don't know what it was like in real life.
*--==--==--*love is real*--==--*imagine*--==--==--*remember*--==--==--*
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n032.3 ---------------
From: Bryan Woodworth <bryanw@666.org>
Subject: Canterbury Public Library
Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 05:23:16 -0700 (PDT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Length: 2496
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Dear subscribers,
Was just surfing the web a few minutes ago and stumbled across something
pretty interesting -- the Canterbury Public Library!
It's pretty interesting. There are a few books on the Parker/Hulme
topic. The Glamuniza/Laurie(sp) book ("A Lesbian View") is in the
catalogue, as is something called "Daughters of Heaven" by Michelanne
Forster, anyone know anything about this? (Published in 1992.) Subject
description says "New Zealand playscripts" (?)
Another thing I just found (I am surfing it now, as I type this) is a
book called "Obsession". Well, here, take a look..
--begin
MATERIAL: Book
AUTHOR: Gurr, Thomas Stuart
TITLE: Obsession / by Tom Gurr and H. H. Cox.
PUBLISHER: London : F. Muller, [1958].
DESCRIPTION: 254 p.
NOTES: Novel based on the case of Pauline Parker and Juliet
Hulme who were tried for the murder of Mrs Parker at
Christchurch in June 1954.
SUBJECT: Parker, Pauline, 1938---Fiction.
SUBJECT: Hulme, Juliet, 1938---Fiction.
SUBJECT: New Zealand fiction.
--end
That's in the "FICTION" section, by the way.
There's also another interesting item..
--begin
MATERIAL: Book
TITLE: The Trial of Pauline Yvonne Parker and Juliet Marion
Hulme, August, 1954.
PUBLISHER: [Christchurch, N.Z. : Canterbury Public Library, 1954]
DESCRIPTION: [32] leaves : ports. ; 37 cm.
NOTES: Newspaper clippings from the Christchurch "Star-Sun"
and "Press", August, 1954 mounted and bound.
SUBJECT: Hulme, Juliet, 1938---Trials, litigation, etc.
SUBJECT: Parker, Pauline, 1938---Trials, litigation, etc.
SUBJECT: Trials (Murder)--New Zealand--Christchurch.
--end
I'd be interested in learning more about these items. Has anyone read
them? (I hope I'm not repeating information already in the FAQ!)
For those curious, just surf to
http://www.ccc.govt.nz/Library/
and click on "Online Catalogue" -- you have to login as "opac".
Has anyone seen other resources such as this on the web, which they'd
like to share?
Best regards,
Bryan Woodworth
Moderator
Heavenly Creatures Mailing List
--
"'Tis indeed a miracle, one must feel,
that two such heavenly creatures are real." bryan woodworth
-- "Heavenly Creatures," 1994 bryanw@borovnia.666.org
http://www.reflection.org/heavenly/
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n032.4 ---------------
From: Sandra Bowdler <sbowdler@uniwa.uwa.edu.au>
Subject: Re: Canterbury Public Library
Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 22:18:40 +0800 (WST)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
Hello all -
On Mon, 20 May 1996, Bryan Woodworth wrote:
> catalogue, as is something called "Daughters of Heaven" by Michelanne
> Forster, anyone know anything about this? (Published in 1992.) Subject
> description says "New Zealand playscripts" (?)
This is a play first performed at the Court Theatre, Christchurch, on 19
October 1991, published in 1992. I have a copy of it, and I have heard
it broadcast on the ABC (Australian Broadcasting Commission) last year.
It is a somwhat darker interpretation than that of Peter Jackson. It is
discussed in the FAQ.
> Another thing I just found (I am surfing it now, as I type this) is a
> book called "Obsession". Well, here, take a look..
>
> --begin
> MATERIAL: Book
> AUTHOR: Gurr, Thomas Stuart
>
> TITLE: Obsession / by Tom Gurr and H. H. Cox.
>
> PUBLISHER: London : F. Muller, [1958].
> DESCRIPTION: 254 p.
>
I have read this also. It is a fictionalised narrative of the
Parker-Hulme case, reasonably accurate, not especially sympathetic, and
written in an extraordinarily pedestrian style. Also referenced in the
FAQ, as is their non-fiction account, which comes complete with
photographs of Pauline's diary entries and the rivulets of blood on the
path at Cashmere. [a chapter in T. Gurr and H. H. Cox 1957 *Famous
Australasian Crimes*, Frederick Muller, London.]
Hope this is helpful,
Sandra Bowdler
sbowdler@uniwa.uwa.edu.au
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n032.5 ---------------
From: Michael Chin <mktchin@cosmos.net.au>
Subject: Up the duff
Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 00:19:57 +1000
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hi there
> >1) Pregnant. (Likely)
>
> it's an old expression in nz
Also an old Australian and British expression.
BTW how did the original poster get sodomised out of the context of the movie?
Michael Chin <mktchin@cosmos.net.au> Melbourne, Australia.
<mktc@yallara.cs.rmit.edu.au> PostGradDipCS, RMIT.
Northcote CHC's SDO.....................Office: +61 3 9486 3411
"What do Jane Austen, Peter Jackson, Heavenly Creatures,
Kate Winslet, Melanie Lynskey, indie-pop, Apples, atheism,
rationality and small, under-powered cars all have in common?"
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n032.6 ---------------
From: Sandra Bowdler <sbowdler@uniwa.uwa.edu.au>
Subject: ABC Broadcast
Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 22:34:33 +0800 (WST)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
Hello again -
I just looked up my notes to see when the broadcast was of Daughters of
Heaven, and discovered it to have been on June 20 last year - two days
before the 51st anniversary of Honora Parker's death.
Coincidence?
cheers
Sandra Bowdler
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n032.7 ---------------
From: Erica Jamieson <beatles@wchat.on.ca>
Subject: Re: Up the duff
Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 13:26:37 -0700
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hi Everyone!
On May 20 Micheal wrote:
>BTW how did the original poster get sodomised out of the context of the movie?
I've heard the word "duff" used as slang for ass before. Example: "Fall on
your duff". I also figured that they meant that she gets it up the ass on
the first night together.
Erica
???????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
I believe, this is heaven
To no one else but me
And I'll defend it as long as
I can be left here to linger
In silence if I choose to
Would you try to understand
- Sarah
McLachlan
???????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n032.8 ---------------
From: Sandra Bowdler <sbowdler@uniwa.uwa.edu.au>
Subject: ABC Broadcast - oops
Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 10:44:38 +0800 (WST)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
<<Hello again -
I just looked up my notes to see when the broadcast was of Daughters of
Heaven, and discovered it to have been on June 20 last year - two days
before the 51st anniversary of Honora Parker's death.>>
Yes, well, of course, that should be *41st*.
cheers
sb
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n032.9 ---------------
From: kate ann jacobson <kjac@unm.edu>
Subject: the birth of a cushion
Date: Mon, 20 May 1996 22:33:12 -0600 (MDT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
Hi everyone,
While we're on the subject of Diello's conception, I just want to
say that one scene that always makes me giggle is Juliet's giving
birth to Diello. This scene is brilliant because, as I noticed even
the first time I saw it, it seems to be a satire on modern movie
scenes where someone has a baby. Rather than have the girls use
fifties' expressions like "Boil some hot water!", they act out a scene
that, even if they had known about natural childbirth, could not be
more cheesily modern and cliched ( Push...it's coming...Oh God, it's
a boy!... Deborah, we have a son and heir... I shall call him..
Diello!... You're such an incredible woman!... I couldn't have done it
without you, Charles! )
Of course, the thing that makes this really funny is Kate and
Melanie's complete sincerity during this whole scene.
-- kate
--------------- END heavenly-c.v001.n032 ---------------
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-------------- BEGIN heavenly-c.v001.n033 --------------
001 - 9506148v@Magpie.Magill.Un - Re: Canterbury Library stuff
002 - mailcall <mailcall@kiva.n - Re: Digest heavenly-c.v001.n032
003 - Sandra Bowdler <sbowdler@ - Re: Canterbury Library stuff
004 - Donald Chin <donaldc@nets - Re: Canterbury Public Library
005 - Sandra Bowdler <sbowdler@ - Re: Canterbury Public Library
006 - kate ann jacobson <kjac@u - Fantasy Ilam
007 - miranda.kaye@stonebow.ota - Re: Fantasy Ilam and Daughters of Heaven
008 - "Jefferson F. Morris" <jf - Re: Up the duff
009 - Thaiphong Vo <thaivo@ea.o - Re: Broken link on Hideous page...
010 - Thaiphong Vo <thaivo@ea.o - Re: the birth of a cushion
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n033.1 ---------------
From: 9506148v@Magpie.Magill.UniSA.edu.au
Subject: Re: Canterbury Library stuff
Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 17:46:27 +0930
First : I tried sending this message before - my computer is stuffing me
around, so I apologise if this message appears twice.
um...
Daughters of Heaven : definitely out of print. You'll have to get it from a
library if you want to read it. If you want to own it,
photocopy it (I didn't say that) or look for a 2nd
hand copy. BTW, you'd think they'd do a new run of it,
after the success of the film, no?
Obsession : also out of print, and you'll need a pretty good library to get
it, unless you're just lucky. I tried Barr Smith library in
Adelaide (huge, 3 storey library) - no go. If anyone has it,
I'd love to hear from you... please?
I don't know about that other item of bound bits and pieces (news articles
etc). Is it published? Can we get it? Do I sound a trifle obsessive? Can
anyone help me (about the book - not the obsession)? Please!
Shannon. <9506148v@magpie.magill.unisa.edu.au>
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n033.2 ---------------
From: mailcall <mailcall@kiva.net>
Subject: Re: Digest heavenly-c.v001.n032
Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 03:20:50 -0500 (EST)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
: scene that always makes me giggle is Juliet's giving
: birth to Diello. This scene is brilliant because, as I noticed even
: the first time I saw it, it seems to be a satire on modern movie
: scenes where someone has a baby. Rather than have the girls use
: fifties' expressions like "Boil some hot water!",
they seemed to be farther along than the "boil some water" (and "get some
clean cloths") stage. that's the second thing that is said (the first
being "charles! the baby's coming!" in a tone of excitement tinged with
hoarse hysteria).
: that, even if they had known about natural childbirth, could not be
: more cheesily modern and cliched ( Push...it's coming....) [etc]
the first thing i noticed was that kate as juliet/deborah was enacting a
real natural childbirth, in just the way ladies have been taught to do it
for ages; she would bear down and then rest for a moment, with little
panting breaths through her mouth, then bear down again.
i also realised that charles delivered diello without other assistance.
that struck me as unusual for a story about mediaeval times, and -did-
make it look more like a modern film birth scene. you would think the
girls would play that deborah had a midwife. pauline could have played the
midwife (at first i thought she -was-), or the midwife could have been a
non-player character (i.e. they'd just imagine she was there). this is as
common in sustained imaginative games as it is in "dungeons and dragons".
in the context of the story, we can wonder if charles and deborah were
shipwrecked on a desert island, or lost in the wilderness.
melanie's pauline portrayed charles as not particularly helpful. he tells
her to push at the wrong moment; she's just gone through a contraction
and is in the breathing part of the cycle when he says it. to be
completely realistic, he should have waited for the next contraction to
begin before yelling "push." he does not hold her hand, nor does he give
her a cloth or anything to pull on.
i assumed the scene was meant to be based on something pauline and juliet
either really did, or could have done. walsh and jackson did excellent
research -- even "cute little touches" in the film turned out to be
totally reality-based. so yes, i could believe that this was not intended
to satirise modern film birth scenes, but an attempt to show the birth of
diello as the girls had done it.
if they did enact diello's birth in this way, the girls knew -something-
about natural childbirth, but not enough.
pauline and juliet could have read up on natural childbirth, just as they
studied the coronation ceremonies so they could have a proper coronation
for diello (see the holy scriptures, chapter thingy, verse whatsit).
maybe they sneaked a book out of the library, or asked an older friend.
remember, they knew a lot of college students, even graduate students. i
think they probably did this, rather than getting a book, because they
knew what the mother goes through, but not what the midwife or other
assistants are supposed to do.
or maybe kate and melanie just improvised the whole thing. heh.
*--==--==--*love is real*--==--*imagine*--==--==--*remember*--==--==--*
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n033.3 ---------------
From: Sandra Bowdler <sbowdler@uniwa.uwa.edu.au>
Subject: Re: Canterbury Library stuff
Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 16:27:29 +0800 (WST)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
On Tue, 21 May 1996 9506148v@Magpie.Magill.UniSA.edu.au wrote:
>
> Obsession : also out of print, and you'll need a pretty good library to get
> it, unless you're just lucky. I tried Barr Smith library in
> Adelaide (huge, 3 storey library) - no go. If anyone has it,
> I'd love to hear from you... please?
>
I don't personally have a copy of this, but I do know the National
Library in Canberra has it.
cheers
sb
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n033.4 ---------------
From: Donald Chin <donaldc@netspace.net.au>
Subject: Re: Canterbury Public Library
Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 21:51:53 +1000
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hi all,
Sandra Bowdler <sbowdler@uniwa.uwa.edu.au> wrote...
> > catalogue, as is something called "Daughters of Heaven" by Michelanne
> > Forster, anyone know anything about this? (Published in 1992.) Subject
> > description says "New Zealand playscripts" (?)
>
> This is a play first performed at the Court Theatre, Christchurch, on 19
> October 1991, published in 1992. I have a copy of it, and I have heard
> it broadcast on the ABC (Australian Broadcasting Commission) last year.
> It is a somwhat darker interpretation than that of Peter Jackson. It is
> discussed in the FAQ.
Was this broadcast on ABC-TV or through their Radio National network? If it
was on RN, then the tapes of it should be available through a ABC Shop? I
don't remember seeing it on ABC-TV last year.
Regards, Donald
--
Donald Chin <donaldc@netspace.net.au>
"Lost somewhere in Australia...
and fanatical about Heavenly Creatures and Jane Austen!"
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n033.5 ---------------
From: Sandra Bowdler <sbowdler@uniwa.uwa.edu.au>
Subject: Re: Canterbury Public Library
Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 21:05:22 +0800 (WST)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
Donald, and other creatures,
Sorry, I obviously didn't make it very clear - it was a radio broadcast,
and it must have been on ABC Classic FM because that is the only radio
station I listen to. I didn't know it was scheduled,I just happened to
turn on the wireless and there it was. I had already read the playscript
so I recognized it more or less immediately.
I wouldn't say it was particularly brilliant, but it might be interesting
to acquire the tape. I think it was a NZ production (they certainly had
NZ accents, as appropriate), and I vaguely remember hearing the names of
the performers at the end, and not recognizing any of them.
I hope this helps,
cheers
sb
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n033.6 ---------------
From: kate ann jacobson <kjac@unm.edu>
Subject: Fantasy Ilam
Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 19:14:47 -0600 (MDT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
Hi everyone,
I really wish I was in New Zealand right now, but since all I can do is
imagine, this would be my dream day at Juliet's old house (please forgive
the errors describing Ilam - I've never actually been there)
_ We are dining at Ilam Homestead, upstairs. It is about six pm.
We have just finished our cool glasses of wine. I go to the window
to meditate on the fact that the very gardens I see below me are
where Paul and Juliet ran themselves, and laughed, and shared their
ideas. Suddenly, perhaps from being overwhelmed, I fall out the
window, a couple of stories (this doesn't have to be realistic).
I'm not hurt, but I need a place to calm down, so I find a huge old
tree sit under. The Great Tree, I notice, has some kind of slit
in it, and distractedly, I reach in , expecting to pull out dry
branches. Instead, my hand runs across something old and leathery
and wet, with what I'm sure are crispy pages inside. I know before
I have time to know. The Diaries. My fingers cannot stop running
across the book. Nothing in the world can convince me that I have
not found the lost diaries of Pauline Reiper.
Nothing, that is, until I actually pull the book out. It's
incredibly antique looking with a burgundy cover. The pages are
curled and yellow, but not in a dusty, depressing way. They're
alive, and almost scented, like a yellow rose, like the person
who wrote them forty-two years ago. Her initials are engraved on the
first page, solitary, with no "New Zealand's Handy Diary" written
above - J. M. H.
Though I walk back to Ilam feeling like I've just seen a unicorn
or something, the real revelation comes later that evening. In bed,
with a flashlight, I open The Book once more, to read her name and
make sure this is all real. And something falls out. Something not
one of the diary pages, but a newer looking envelope. Nothing at all
is written on the front. I have a peculiar, out-of-nowhere idea
that this will be something from Hilda, but, to say the least, it
isn't:
December 10, 1965
I have come to return these to where they belong, where we
buried our dead ideas. I have had them all these years. I knew
your mother would burn them That Night, she did all but say so
when they found mine. I knew they had to be with me. Somehow
I knew no one would find them, and no one ever did. One thing
about people who work in places like that is they couldn't
be more ignorant about books of any sort, and in a way it
was a blessing.
I thought I would feel older and sadder coming back here
today after nine years, but I don't. I feel very refreshed and
clear-headed and I think Ilam is a perfect image to end my
years in New Zealand, for I'm leaving tomorrow - officially.
It's wierd, but being here makes me wonder about where you
are less.
I should forget, as the song goes, but in the loneliness
of night I start remembering everything.
I will bury our story in a tree forever
I keep Juliet's diaries a long,long time before I ever read them.....
( I hope I didn't offend anyone with this! I would never, ever
presume to know what Pauline felt in any situation! The letter
was just a part of my imagination )
--kate
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n033.7 ---------------
From: miranda.kaye@stonebow.otago.ac.nz (Miranda Kaye)
Subject: Re: Fantasy Ilam and Daughters of Heaven
Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 15:37:26 +1200 (NZST)
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
kate ann jacobson wrote:
> I really wish I was in New Zealand right now, but since all I can do is
> imagine, this would be my dream day at Juliet's old house (please forgive
> the errors describing Ilam - I've never actually been there)
Just to burst your bubble, Ilam isn't as glorious now as it was then -
inhabited by the Canterbury Uni Staff Club, and surrounded on one side by a
sports field, on another by a monstrous student hall of residence. Gardens
are still grand, though - and the bridge Kate's dainty feet ran over is
there.
My personal fantasy is finding Pauline working in a small suburban bookshop
in rural New Zealand . . .
As for Michelanne Forster's play:
>Daughters of Heaven : definitely out of print. You'll have to get it from a
> library if you want to read it. If you want to own it,
> photocopy it (I didn't say that) or look for a 2nd
> hand copy. BTW, you'd think they'd do a new run of it,
> after the success of the film, no?
I've checked with my local bookstore, and they not only have 3 copies in
stock, but they are certain Victoria University Press is still printing it
in NZ. Not much help for those of you not residing on New Zealand's
gracious shores, but if you're really really keen you can contact VUP or my
bookshop of choice, the University Book Shop, Dunedin (fax# +64 3 4776571)
to track down a copy.
M.
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n033.8 ---------------
From: "Jefferson F. Morris" <jfmorris@CapAccess.org>
Subject: Re: Up the duff
Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 01:27:17 -0400 (EDT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
On Mon, 20 May 1996, Erica Jamieson wrote:
> Hi Everyone!
>
> On May 20 Micheal wrote:
>
> >BTW how did the original poster get sodomised out of the context of the movie?
>
> I've heard the word "duff" used as slang for ass before. Example: "Fall on
> your duff". I also figured that they meant that she gets it up the ass on
> the first night together.
You read the 'original poster's' mind, Erica. That was in fact my thought
process. I never thought it was a likely meaning though. The girls'
imaginations ran towards the explicit, but not that explicit. But I guess
it's settled now. I can use the phrase proudly, confident of its meaning.
--Jefferson
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n033.9 ---------------
From: Thaiphong Vo <thaivo@ea.oac.uci.edu>
Subject: Re: Broken link on Hideous page...
Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 23:09:19 -0700 (PDT)
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>I just visited the Jean's fabulous page. The pictures are just wonderful.
I agree! Thanks Jean! I can't believe our luck that you're around. : ) btw-
did you take those pictures yourself? I thought the one where the girls are
viewable through the camera was especially good.
-Thai
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n033.10 ---------------
From: Thaiphong Vo <thaivo@ea.oac.uci.edu>
Subject: Re: the birth of a cushion
Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 23:10:05 -0700 (PDT)
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
> Hi everyone,
: )
> that, even if they had known about natural childbirth, could not be
> more cheesily modern and cliched ( Push...it's coming...Oh God, it's
Something which also gave me a slight chuckle was the large ammount of
perspiration on Kate's forehead. It made me think that she'd been pushing
for quite some time.. Imagine it, trying to force a nonexistent baby out!
Another thing was how Melanie's quick and happy "oh." as she started to
carry the "baby" to Kate. Her facial expression was so sincere! They were
so into it you can't help but smile. : )
-Thai
--------------- END heavenly-c.v001.n033 ---------------
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-------------- BEGIN heavenly-c.v001.n034 --------------
001 - GorillaBlu@aol.com - Re: Digest heavenly-c.v001.n033
002 - orson@CAM.ORG (Jean Gueri - Re: Broken link on Hideous page...
003 - orson@CAM.ORG (Jean Gueri - Peter Jackson/Kong Update
004 - Sandra Bowdler <sbowdler@ - Re: Broken link on Hideous page...
005 - Erica Jamieson <beatles@w - Re: Up the duff
006 - Jane <misc1341@cantva.can - Alison Laurie article
007 - Tim Baglio <raven@nas.com - Re: Up the duff
008 - "Jefferson F. Morris" <jf - OFF already: Dirty words
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n034.1 ---------------
From: GorillaBlu@aol.com
Subject: Re: Digest heavenly-c.v001.n033
Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 02:58:25 -0400
In a message dated 96-05-22 02:11:48 EDT, you write:
>I've checked with my local bookstore, and they not only have 3 copies in
>stock, but they are certain Victoria University Press is still printing it
>in NZ. Not much help for those of you not residing on New Zealand's
>gracious shores, but if you're really really keen you can contact VUP or my
>bookshop of choice, the University Book Shop, Dunedin (fax# +64 3 4776571)
>to track down a copy.
Hi all! I am copying this directly from the FAQ:
6.1 "Daughters of Heaven." [mf,jp]
-----------------------------------------------------------------
Forster, Michaelanne.
"Daughters of Heaven." Victoria University Press, Victoria
University of Wellington, PO Box 600, Wellington, NZ, 1992.
ISBN 0 86473 240 6 (contact Fergus Barrowman, Editor, for
ordering information).
"Daughters of Heaven" received the Buckland Prize for
Literature(NZ) in 1993.
I have been thinking of tracking this down since I first read
of it in the FAQ. Glad someone brought it up and reminded
me I wanted it!
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n034.2 ---------------
From: orson@CAM.ORG (Jean Guerin)
Subject: Re: Broken link on Hideous page...
Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 03:23:06 -0400
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>>I just visited the Jean's fabulous page. The pictures are just wonderful.
Please...I'm blushing
>
>I agree! Thanks Jean! I can't believe our luck that you're around. : ) btw-
>did you take those pictures yourself? I thought the one where the girls are
>viewable through the camera was especially good.
I took the pictures myself except the one of me and the girls (where I
handed my camera to Pierre, the stills photographer) and the Kiwizilla
photos (where I handed it to Fran Walsh).
The monitor photo shows how the film was shot in 4 perf super 35mm and
framed simultaneously for widescreen (that's 2 perf-see the black lines on
the monitor?) and it's eventual video transfer (4 perf - or perforations).
It's a shame that, in transferring the film to video the full negative was
not used and that a pan and scan off the widescreen print was made instead.
The NZ video is from the original negative and has extra visual information
above and below.
Sorry about the costume test polaroid. I'll have this fixed soon.
I don't have much more in terms of pictures. It's hard to carry a camera
around when you are acting. Also it was a tad dammaged on the flight over.
There was also the fact that usually only the still photographer is allowed
to take pictures.
The first photo I took is of Peter flanked by the girls covered in blood on
the trail in Victoria Park (the opening scene). I had to promise I wouldn't
show that one as it would give a wrong idea about Peter's new film. He was
trying to shed his gore image and having a picture of Mel and Kate covered
in colored maple syrup would certainly ensure the label stuck.
I'm glad you enjoyed the pictures. The page will have more in it but it
will be links to my other passions (Godzilla, Hong Kong Movies, the HC
pages and the upcoming Fant-Asia festival) as well as photos of other
endeavors.
E. Jean Guerin
Director of Programming
FANT-ASIA Film Festival
Montreal, Canada
also: Film Critic (HOUR magazine) & Journalist (Cinefantastique)
Cult/Trash Cinema specialist (CBC-Radio's Brave New Waves)
Actor (_Heavenly Creatures_,_Frankenstein & Me_,_La Vengeance de la
Femme en Noir_)
The critics rave!
"The Most Hideous Man Alive"
-Kate Winslet, Academy Award Nominee
"Sexy Demon"
-TIME Magazine.
orson@cam.org
http://www.cam.org/~orson/index.html
==============================================================================
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n034.3 ---------------
From: orson@CAM.ORG (Jean Guerin)
Subject: Peter Jackson/Kong Update
Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 03:23:10 -0400
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hi all!
I called NZ the other night and spoke to Fran (Walsh). I was calling them
to congratulate Peter on his new deal with Universal. Variety reported that
he would be paid $6.5 million (plus bonuses) to direct the "King Kong"
remake. That figure is most likely inflated but the deal is causing some
major rumbles:
-That would make Jackson one of the highest paid directors in Tinseltown.
Thsi would be an unprecedented event given that he has had one succesful
feature (read "with good box-office) in the US. However it should be
pointed that he delivered "The Frighteners" on time and below budget for
less than half the cost that a similar production would have cost Universal
in LA - that in itself is an unprecedented event (especially in the shadow
of Waterworld)!
I can say this about "Kong": it will be a period piece (set in the 30s) and
will be shot at WETA (Wingnut Effects and Technical Allusions)- Peter's new
facility in Wellington.
I suggested Kate Winslett for the Fay Wray role. Fran laughed and said
"Funny you should mention that. She thinks the same thing. In fac, she's
very keen on it"
I'm hoping to be a part of it (the original is one of my favorite films). I
jokingly suggested they could set it later in the thirties and have Orson
Welles be the MC (on radio as well) at Kong's Broadway debut and that
hisnews of Kon's escape would be met with skepticism for radio listeners.
Fran thought it was a cute idea but didn't want to typecast me which is
fine since I dropped 20 or so pounds since then (which is why I had to get
my cheeks padded with prosthetic makeup when I reprised the role in a
French-Canadian production last fall)- besides - I don't want to become
typecast like my friend Paul Marco. I suggested that I'd either like to
play a canadian sailor on the Skull Island expedition or a reporter in NY.
I just want to be squished by Kong!
Not to mention working with Peter, Fran and (possibly) Kate as well.
E. Jean Guerin
Director of Programming
FANT-ASIA Film Festival
Montreal, Canada
also: Film Critic (HOUR magazine) & Journalist (Cinefantastique)
Cult/Trash Cinema specialist (CBC-Radio's Brave New Waves)
Actor (_Heavenly Creatures_,_Frankenstein & Me_,_La Vengeance de la
Femme en Noir_)
The critics rave!
"The Most Hideous Man Alive"
-Kate Winslet, Academy Award Nominee
"Sexy Demon"
-TIME Magazine.
orson@cam.org
http://www.cam.org/~orson/index.html
==============================================================================
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n034.4 ---------------
From: Sandra Bowdler <sbowdler@uniwa.uwa.edu.au>
Subject: Re: Broken link on Hideous page...
Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 19:08:43 +0800 (WST)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
Bon Jour Jean, and other creatures,
The pictures are terrific, thanks a heap.
Just a question about the one of the tea rooms - did you take that? If
so, when, given that it's now torn down? I have a copy of a black and
white photo of the same building taken from another angle, presumably
some time in the 1950s.
Good to hear that Peter Jackson is getting appropriate recognition, but I
must admit to reservations about another remake of King Kong. The
original is a wonderful classic, why does a really creative person like
Jackson need to do it again?
cheers
Sandra Bowdler
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n034.5 ---------------
From: Erica Jamieson <beatles@wchat.on.ca>
Subject: Re: Up the duff
Date: Wed, 22 May 1996 08:32:25 -0700
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
On Wed, May 22, 1996 Jefferson wrote:
>You read the 'original poster's' mind, Erica. That was in fact my thought
>process. I never thought it was a likely meaning though. The girls'
>imaginations ran towards the explicit, but not that explicit. But I guess
>it's settled now. I can use the phrase proudly, confident of its meaning.
>
> --Jeffers
>
I think their imaginations actually did run that explicit. I've noticed that
young people, especially British young people dipicted in movies are often
very explicit in their vocabulary. Such as when Juliet told Jonsy to "Go on,
bugger off"! If you saw the film, "Hope and Glory", based in Wartime
England, they show children, younger than Pauline and Juliet using
statements such as "bugger", and "sod", and they definitely knew what they
were saying.
Anyway, that's what I think.
Erica
???????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
I believe, this is heaven
To no one else but me
And I'll defend it as long as
I can be left here to linger
In silence if I choose to
Would you try to understand
- Sarah
McLachlan
???????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n034.6 ---------------
From: Jane <misc1341@cantva.canterbury.ac.nz>
Subject: Alison Laurie article
Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 10:34:00 +1300
Hi folks,
I am - at last - sending off copies of Alison Lauries article
Heavenly Lesbians: A Murder Re-Visited. Apologies for taking so long
in doing so, but life has this nasty habit of interfereing in
emailing schedules. If anyone has asked me for a copy of the article
and not yet received it, could they please let me know. Also if
there is anyone else wanting a copy feel free to email me,
Jane
_...._
/ \
/ o __ o \
( \/ )
) (
( - - - )
( )
( )
------------------/l\ /l\-------------------
------------------------------------------
( )
( __ _)
'Jackson's unique craft, combined with his acceptance of
the unaltered, unglossed Kiwi environment, makes him
literally unique in the world, possibly the galaxy. I
wonder what he tastes like?' (Chris Hegan, The Listener)
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n034.7 ---------------
From: Tim Baglio <raven@nas.com>
Subject: Re: Up the duff
Date: Tue, 21 May 1996 12:56:04 +0000 (GMT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
> I think their imaginations actually did run that explicit. I've noticed that
> young people, especially British young people dipicted in movies are often
> very explicit in their vocabulary. Such as when Juliet told Jonsy to "Go on,
> bugger off"! If you saw the film, "Hope and Glory", based in Wartime
> England, they show children, younger than Pauline and Juliet using
> statements such as "bugger", and "sod", and they definitely knew what they
> were saying.
Well, I say bugger off all the time, and here in America, it more or less
means "go away" rather than what it really means. And it's not too common
here. I'm 16 and have used it for some time and have probably always
known what it meant. But I don't think it holds the same connotations here.
_______________________________________________
| |
| Tim Baglio http://www.nas.com/~raven/ |
| raven@nas.com Bellingham, WA |
|_______________________________________________|
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n034.8 ---------------
From: "Jefferson F. Morris" <jfmorris@CapAccess.org>
Subject: OFF already: Dirty words
Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 01:26:30 -0400 (EDT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
On Tue, 21 May 1996, Tim Baglio wrote:
> Well, I say bugger off all the time, and here in America, it more or less
> means "go away" rather than what it really means. And it's not too common
> here. I'm 16 and have used it for some time and have probably always
> known what it meant. But I don't think it holds the same connotations here.
It's possible for these kind of phrases to lose the potency of their
original meaning. For example, in America it's pretty much acceptable to
say, "This sucks," or "That sucks." You can even say something "blows" with
impunity. I had a teacher in high school who considered "sucks" to be an
obscenity, referring as it does to oral-genital hijinks. But now it's so
common that most kids probably say it without much of an inkling about
its derivation. "Bugger off" is probably the same thing.
Hell, wasn't "bloody" supposed to be something of a course adjective at
one time? My mother is actually from England (Miss Stewart) and I seem to
remember her telling me that once. She remarked at how
much the characters in one particular Monty Python sketch were "cursing."
(The coal-miner's sketch, in case you're wondering). All they were doing
was saying 'bloody' over and over again. But I don't know. Maybe my
mother's just weird.
--Jefferson
--------------- END heavenly-c.v001.n034 ---------------
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-------------- BEGIN heavenly-c.v001.n035 --------------
001 - GorillaBlu@aol.com - Re: Jean's photos
002 - adamabr@asterix.helix.net - Orson's first picture
003 - 9506148v@Magpie.Magill.Un - Re: Bugger off etc.
004 - Erica Jamieson <beatles@w - Re: Up the Duff
005 - Thaiphong Vo <thaivo@ea.o - Re: Peter Jackson/Kong Update
006 - kate ann jacobson <kjac@u - whatever became of those drawings.....
007 - orson@CAM.ORG (Jean Gueri - Re: Up the Duff-ENOUGH ALREADY!
008 - eireann1@qnet.com (Eirean - Introduction...
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n035.1 ---------------
From: GorillaBlu@aol.com
Subject: Re: Jean's photos
Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 04:23:54 -0400
In a message dated 96-05-23 03:03:36 EDT, you write:
>The first photo I took is of Peter flanked by the girls covered in blood on
>the trail in Victoria Park (the opening scene). I had to promise I wouldn't
>show that one as it would give a wrong idea about Peter's new film. He was
>trying to shed his gore image and having a picture of Mel and Kate covered
>in colored maple syrup would certainly ensure the label stuck.
Jean - you have no idea how tempting it is to beg. That would be an
awesome picture to see. Thanks for sharing the rest, though - the
photo of Kate and Melanie on the bench is now my favorite HC still
photo. And the camera shot is beautiful. Thanks!
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n035.2 ---------------
From: adamabr@asterix.helix.net (Adam Abrams)
Subject: Orson's first picture
Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 02:15:13 -0800
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Orson wrote...
>The first photo I took is of Peter flanked by the girls covered in blood on
>the trail in Victoria Park (the opening scene). I had to promise I wouldn't
>show that one as it would give a wrong idea about Peter's new film. He was
>trying to shed his gore image and having a picture of Mel and Kate covered
>in colored maple syrup would certainly ensure the label stuck.
...well, now that everyone knows what "HC" is all about, and Jackson seems
to have escaped typecasting, it should be safe to show us that one, hmmmm?
It sounds like one of the best of the lot!
Meanwhile, Sandra opined...
>Good to hear that Peter Jackson is getting appropriate recognition, but I
>must admit to reservations about another remake of King Kong. The
>original is a wonderful classic, why does a really creative person like
>Jackson need to do it again?
I must agree with Sandra here - remaking a classic like Kong has me saying
"why?". Unless PJ puts a really irreverent madcap spin on it, (what else!)
it would seem a bit redundant.
You'd want to at least update it, but Dino De Laurentis already did that
too (and as I recall it actually was kinda fun...)
TTYL
Adam
==========================================================================
Only the best people fight against Adam Abrams
all obstacles... in pursuit of happiness! Vancouver, BC, Canada
--Juliet Hulme, "Heavenly Creatures"
*Visit the "Fourth World" at http://www.helix.net/~adamabr/creatures.html*
==========================================================================
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n035.3 ---------------
From: 9506148v@Magpie.Magill.UniSA.edu.au
Subject: Re: Bugger off etc.
Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 20:51:13 +0930
Dear _________ ,
In my part of the world, 'bugger off' does not have anything to do with
sodomy, and likewise with 'sod off'. I would have assumed that this was
the case with most, if not all, parts of the world. I know full well what
the literal meanings of the words are, but like 'fuck off', the meanings
of the sayings don't seem to bear much resemblance to the individual words.
My guess is that 'obscene' words like these are used out of context simply
because they get your attention.
So, I don't really think that P & J were being obscene on this occasion.
There is reference, however, in Pauline's diaries (G&L or the FAQ) to the
fact that P & J used to discuss, during meals, how the 'sanitary habits' of
the Saints interfered with sex, so I can only presume that they would quite
frequently have tried to be as obscene as possible.
Bye.
Shannon.
p.s. I got a call from my local bookseller today (the same one that told me
that DOH was 'definitely' out of print). It seems they have a copy of
DOH waiting for me. I never cease to be amazed.
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n035.4 ---------------
From: Erica Jamieson <beatles@wchat.on.ca>
Subject: Re: Up the Duff
Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 06:33:42 -0700
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hello,
Okay, so I was wrong. Didn't mean to offend anybody. I guess I do use those
"bad" words too, and I don't mean them literally. Silly me.
But I still think up the bloody duff means up the sodding arse!!
:) Erica
???????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
I believe, this is heaven
To no one else but me
And I'll defend it as long as
I can be left here to linger
In silence if I choose to
Would you try to understand
- Sarah
McLachlan
???????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n035.5 ---------------
From: Thaiphong Vo <thaivo@ea.oac.uci.edu>
Subject: Re: Peter Jackson/Kong Update
Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 07:01:03 -0700 (PDT)
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
t>he would be paid $6.5 million (plus bonuses) to direct the "King Kong"
>remake. That figure is most likely inflated but the deal is causing some
>major rumbles:
I can't think of a better choice in directors for Kong.. : )
>I suggested Kate Winslett for the Fay Wray role. Fran laughed and said
>"Funny you should mention that. She thinks the same thing. In fac, she's
>very keen on it"
You know that it would be either me or Bryan that's going to mention this,
but whattaboot Melanie?!? : )
>I just want to be squished by Kong!
hope your wish comes true.. Of course not literally.. : ) I bet it'd be
so much fun!
-Thai
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n035.6 ---------------
From: kate ann jacobson <kjac@unm.edu>
Subject: whatever became of those drawings.....
Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 21:24:47 -0600 (MDT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
> would you let anyone know that you had them,send them to julie,or would
> you just keep them like a beautiful treasure?
I'd keep them forever like a beautiful treasure.
>You know that it would be either me or Bryan that's going to mention this
>but whattabout Melanie?!?
Can't you just picture the ironic expression on Melanie's face as she
screams in the arm of King Kong? I'm cracking up already! ( although if
Kate gets the part, I'm equally thrilled for her! )
Jean, I just want to thank you for sharing your pictures on the web.
They're so cool! I especially like the one of you and the two girls...
By the way, do you happen to know what became of those pictures of Juliet
(the thousands of them) on Paul's bedroom wall? I hope Fran and Peter
didn't throw them away! I would pay handsomely for one of them. Also,
do you know who drew them at all?
just wondering,
kate
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n035.7 ---------------
From: orson@CAM.ORG (Jean Guerin)
Subject: Re: Up the Duff-ENOUGH ALREADY!
Date: Thu, 23 May 1996 02:00:05 -0400
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>Hello,
>
>Okay, so I was wrong. Didn't mean to offend anybody. I guess I do use those
>"bad" words too, and I don't mean them literally. Silly me.
>
>But I still think up the bloody duff means up the sodding arse!!
>
>:) Erica
Taht shot was done when I was down there and I asked Fran Walsh what it
meant: she said pregnant.
Also I picked up a great book entitled "A Personal Kiwi-Yankee Dictionary"
by Louis S. Leland Jr. It translates words and expressions. It reads:
up the spout - up the duff: 'Milady, there's more in your belly than ever
went in through your face' (see: bun in the oven, sprog)
bun in the oven: PREGNANT (see ip the spout - up the duff, sprog)
sprog: (A) an infant
(B) any human OFFSPRING ('your sprog')
(C) "I'm sprogged". I'm PREGNANT (see: up the spout-up the duff)
The upper case characters are as they are in the book.
Interestingly there is no entry for duff.
Can we move on to another subject?
Hideously yours,
Jean G
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n035.8 ---------------
From: eireann1@qnet.com (Eireann Brooks)
Subject: Introduction...
Date: Fri, 24 May 1996 00:12:17 -0700 (PDT)
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Just wanted to introduce myself a little, as a new member to the list...
I'm a 15-year-old college student with a penchant for Susan Sarandon, Linda
Fiorentino, Christine Lahti, and Linda Fiorentino films; Mary Chapin
Carpenter, Joni Mitchell, Suzanne Vega, The Nields, and Dar Williams songs;
and mystery books, including, among others, the Pitt series (not the
Inspector Monks, though) by Anne Perry. I'd been seeing _Heavenly
Creatures_ in my video store on the New Releases shelf for quite some time,
and I knew what it was from all the reviews when it came out, so I'd always
*intend* to get it but never got around to it. But one day, I managed to
convince myself *not* to rent _The Last Seduction_ or _The Hudsucker Proxy_
again, but to get something new, and, there it was. One of the most
beautiful films I've ever seen; wonderfully shot, beautifully acted (which
is surprising, considering that I'd never heard of Mel and didn't much like
Kate), and it had one of the best screenplays I'd ever seen onscreen. So it
became one of my top three favorite movies, and eventually became number
one... which is why I was surprised that there was a mailing list, but I'm
glad there is; it seems like no one else I know *liked* _HC_, much less to
the extent that I did, so I am quite glad that you do exist, somewhere out
there. :)
EB
--
Darly: "Ah, so, um...there was this bear, Honey Bear--"
Sarah: "Huggy Bear."
Darly: "Right, Huggy Bear...and he lived in the zoo--"
Sarah: "Forest."
Darly: "No, the forest burned down, so the trappers sold him to the zoo."
Sarah: "No!"
Darly: "Yes, Sarah, I'm telling you, life can suck."
-from _Leaving Normal_
--------------- END heavenly-c.v001.n035 ---------------
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Date: Sat, 25 May 1996 21:00:24 -0700
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Subject: Digest heavenly-c.v001.n036
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-------------- BEGIN heavenly-c.v001.n036 --------------
001 - Michael Chin <mktchin@cos - Where are HC fans from?
002 - Sandra Bowdler <sbowdler@ - Pauline's birthday
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n036.1 ---------------
From: Michael Chin <mktchin@cosmos.net.au>
Subject: Where are HC fans from?
Date: Sat, 25 May 1996 13:30:22 +1000
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hi Creatures,
I was wondering where the various list Creatures are from?
Bryan, is there a way to list the domain suffices for all the list
recipients?
Yours curiously,
Michael
Michael Chin <mktchin@cosmos.net.au> Melbourne, Australia.
<mktc@yallara.cs.rmit.edu.au> PostGradDipCS, RMIT.
Northcote CHC's SDO.....................Office: +61 3 9486 3411
"What do Jane Austen, Peter Jackson, Heavenly Creatures,
Kate Winslet, Melanie Lynskey, indie-pop, Apples, atheism,
rationality and small, under-powered cars all have in common?"
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n036.2 ---------------
From: Sandra Bowdler <sbowdler@uniwa.uwa.edu.au>
Subject: Pauline's birthday
Date: Sun, 26 May 1996 11:18:51 +0800 (WST)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
Happy birthday Pauline, wherever you are; I, I'm sure we all, hope your
life is happy.
Sandra Bowdler
sbowdler@uniwa.uwa.edu.au
--------------- END heavenly-c.v001.n036 ---------------
From heavenly-c-errors@lists1.best.com Mon May 27 01:14:34 1996
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Subject: Digest heavenly-c.v001.n037
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-------------- BEGIN heavenly-c.v001.n037 --------------
001 - "Quantumleap" <qleap@inte - Greetings!
002 - "Jefferson F. Morris" <jf - Re: Introduction...
003 - "Chris Black" <qleap@inte - Re: Introduction...
004 - adamabr@asterix.helix.net - Let me (re-)introduce myself
005 - adamabr@asterix.helix.net - HC WebFAQ - Remodeling continues!
006 - Tim Baglio <raven@nas.com - what's going on today
007 - "Jefferson F. Morris" <jf - Love/Hate, and HC aspect ratios
008 - "Chris Black" <qleap@inte - Re: Love/Hate, and HC aspect ratios
009 - kate ann jacobson <kjac@u - Re: Love/ Hate and HC aspect ratios
010 - Donald Chin <donaldc@nets - Belated birthday wishes...
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n037.1 ---------------
From: "Quantumleap" <qleap@interl.net>
Subject: Greetings!
Date: Sun, 26 May 1996 14:29:50 +0000
Greetings, all!
Having just found Bryan's wonderful page (and thus this mailing list)
I thought it would be proper for me to say 'hello' to all the other
fans of 'Heavenly Creatures'. So, without further ado...
Hello!
:-)
Cheers,
--Chris
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--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n037.2 ---------------
From: "Jefferson F. Morris" <jfmorris@CapAccess.org>
Subject: Re: Introduction...
Date: Sun, 26 May 1996 16:28:10 -0400 (EDT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
On Fri, 24 May 1996, Eireann Brooks wrote:
> it seems like no one else I know *liked* _HC_, much less to
> the extent that I did, so I am quite glad that you do exist, somewhere out
> there. :)
In my experience, most people who see HC admire it in some way (It was a
critical hit, after all), but they're not completely enraptured and
thrilled the way I was. So people hear me drone on and on about how
fantastic the film is, how it was the best movie of '94 (Yes, better than
Pulp Fiction, which I also loved), how it's one of the best films ever
made, blah blah. But then when I try to introduce them to it, I usually
end up qualifying my praise by saying that "Most people will like it, but
they won't necessarily love it the way I do."
I guess I don't want to raise their hopes too stratospherically high.
I'm one of those possessive film fans who takes the attitude of "You insult
my movies, you insult me." I guess I need to loosen up.
--Jefferson
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n037.3 ---------------
From: "Chris Black" <qleap@interl.net>
Subject: Re: Introduction...
Date: Sun, 26 May 1996 15:37:29 +0000
> From: "Jefferson F. Morris" <jfmorris@CapAccess.org>
> Subject: Re: Introduction...
> Date: Sun, 26 May 1996 16:28:10 -0400 (EDT)
> I guess I don't want to raise their hopes too stratospherically high.
> I'm one of those possessive film fans who takes the attitude of "You insult
> my movies, you insult me." I guess I need to loosen up.
Jefferson,
I also find myself issuing 'disclaimers' to people when I praise films
(especially Heavenly Creatures) for the same reasons you've stated, I
don't want to get their hopes up, and also because I'm an extremely
liberal movie viewer, and most of my friends seem to be more
conservative in their movie viewing.
On another note, I've owned the pan & scan version of Heavenly
Creatures since it came out on video, and what I'd like to know is,
am I missing anything that is included in the letter-box version?
Cheers,
--Chris
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--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n037.4 ---------------
From: adamabr@asterix.helix.net (Adam Abrams)
Subject: Let me (re-)introduce myself
Date: Sun, 26 May 1996 17:05:27 -0800
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hi!
Well, I've been revelling in the back issues of the HC Mailing List,
getting all caught up. What amazing, fascinating, fun reading! Orson's
blooper, Fran's bus cameo, the Canadian recipe for fake blood (felt a deep
surge of patriotism there)... it's all just makin' my head spin. And just
to share in a group that is clued in to the magic and genius of this film
is an unending delight!
Alas, I also realized that I haven't made a formal introduction before just
diving in, as several others have done, and it seemed a nice thing to do.
So here's a really brief bio.
Name: Adam Abrams
Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada
Age: Actual - 31 Mental - 18-25 (varies)
Interests:
-- Graphic Design
-- anything to do with the 70's (especially old disco records)
-- opera (not a major passion but since HC I appreciate it greatly, and
am now a volunteer with the Vancouver Opera.)
-- Video (I also volunteer at the local cable company (community access
channel) and have appeared a few times with satirical little reports...)
-- _everything_ to do with Heavenly Creatures!
(not in that order I'm sure...)
Ambition: To become a famous film director and create something even half
as marvelous as "HC".
Realistic ambition: To work in TV as an editor or segment producer or something
How I fell for "HC": See Vol. 1, #27 of the Mailing List!
Well, I think that's more than enough... now I feel like I'm officially "in".
TTYL,
Adam
==========================================================================
Only the best people fight against Adam Abrams
all obstacles... in pursuit of happiness! Vancouver, BC, Canada
--Juliet Hulme, "Heavenly Creatures"
*Visit the "Fourth World" at http://www.helix.net/~adamabr/creatures.html*
==========================================================================
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n037.5 ---------------
From: adamabr@asterix.helix.net (Adam Abrams)
Subject: HC WebFAQ - Remodeling continues!
Date: Sun, 26 May 1996 17:05:32 -0800
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hello everyone!
Just a quick note to mention the additions to my Heavenly Creatures Website
(HCW):
-- Juliet now welcomes you to the main page (through the
magic of a 40k, automatically-playing audio clip). I welcome feedback on
this...
-- Section 4, "The Film vs. Real Life", is in place and ready to browse.
-- Two new additions on the sounds page - short and sweet, they make great
startup sounds (which is how I use them!). "I'm going to the Fourth
World", and "That's _so_ impressive!"
Enjoy! Oh, and I hope everyone's written Miramax by now regarding the
"Director's Cut"... it's all in the "Crusade" section of the HCW.
Cheers!
Adam
==========================================================================
Visit the "Fourth World" at http://www.helix.net/~adamabr/creatures.html
==========================================================================
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n037.6 ---------------
From: Tim Baglio <raven@nas.com>
Subject: what's going on today
Date: Sat, 25 May 1996 18:39:13 +0000 (GMT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
Well, as you probably all realize already, today is Pauline's birthday
(as well as mine and John Wayne's). I got the movie for my birthday and
that was really neat. Unfortunately, my damn VCR decided to screw up, so
there is this smear at the top of the screen which blinks on and off at
random. That made the viewing a little less pleasant, but after a great
deal of praying, it did not appear once from the beginning of the
victoria park scene to the end. So... I'm happy :)
_______________________________________________
| |
| Tim Baglio http://www.nas.com/~raven/ |
| raven@nas.com Bellingham, WA |
|_______________________________________________|
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n037.7 ---------------
From: "Jefferson F. Morris" <jfmorris@CapAccess.org>
Subject: Love/Hate, and HC aspect ratios
Date: Sun, 26 May 1996 23:30:08 -0400 (EDT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
On Sun, 26 May 1996, Chris Black wrote:
> I also find myself issuing 'disclaimers' to people when I praise films
> (especially Heavenly Creatures) for the same reasons you've stated, I
> don't want to get their hopes up, and also because I'm an extremely
> liberal movie viewer, and most of my friends seem to be more
> conservative in their movie viewing.
I've found that often when a film is described as a "love it or hate it"
experience...I love it. Although I wouldn't call HC a "love it or hate it"
movie. More of a "love it or like it" movie. I haven't met anyone yet who
actually hated the film, and I hope I never do. For their sake, and for the
sake of their families.
> On another note, I've owned the pan & scan version of Heavenly
> Creatures since it came out on video, and what I'd like to know is,
> am I missing anything that is included in the letter-box version?
>From what I've heard (and Mr. Guerin can probably tell us more), the film
was shot in some kind of matted format (Super 35 maybe?), in which parts
of the full frame (which would have roughly the same aspect ratio as your
TV--1.33:1) at the top and bottom are covered up during projection in
order to give the film its intended aspect ratio of 2.35:1. Many
directors shoot this way, making sure that all the important info in
their frames is kept in that widescreen 2.35:1 "window." But then later,
when the film is transferred to video, the mattes can be taken off,
restoring the film to its full 1.33:1 frame, and elminating the need for
either letterboxing or panning and scanning.
But apparently HC was not 'unmasked' in this way when it was put on
tape in America. Normal panning and scanning of a widescreen film typically
discards about 43% of the picture information off the sides. If that
sounds like a lot, it is.
I've got the disc, so I've never seen the film P&S. I ususally prefer
letterboxing even to unmasked transfers, as they preserve the
theatrical composition. And the extra info at the top and bottom usually
doesn't add up to much more than seeing a few extra buttons on people's
shirts. In my experience.
--Jefferson
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n037.8 ---------------
From: "Chris Black" <qleap@interl.net>
Subject: Re: Love/Hate, and HC aspect ratios
Date: Sun, 26 May 1996 23:36:57 +0000
Jefferson,
I also prefer to buy/rent the letter-box edition of movies, but since
it took me long enough to get ahold of this movie in p&s, I was just
happy to get that. :-)
And if I only had a laser disc player. *sighs wistfully* Oh well,
I'll have to keep my eye out for the letterbox edition so I can pick
it up. :-)
Cheers,
--Chris
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--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n037.9 ---------------
From: kate ann jacobson <kjac@unm.edu>
Subject: Re: Love/ Hate and HC aspect ratios
Date: Sun, 26 May 1996 23:52:58 -0600 (MDT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
On May 26, 1996, Jefferson wrote:
>Although I wouldn't call HC a "love it or hate it"
>movie. More of a "love it or like it" movie. I haven't met anyone yet
>who actually hated the film
Then I can see you've never worked in a video store. From my experience,
HC is the queen mother of all "love it or hate it" movies. I've recommended
it to customers I know are pretty liberal- minded and the only middle-
ground comment I've ever heard, the only one, is "well-acted". It's usually
either "brilliant" or "not my type of movie at all".
Just for the record, a "love it or like it" movie is The Shawshank
Redemption - not one negative comment ever.
--kate
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n037.10 ---------------
From: Donald Chin <donaldc@netspace.net.au>
Subject: Belated birthday wishes...
Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 18:10:50 +1000
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hi all,
Belated best wishes for your birthday, Pauline.
Regards, Donald
--
Donald Chin <donaldc@netspace.net.au>
"Lost somewhere in Australia...
and fanatical about Heavenly Creatures and Jane Austen!"
--------------- END heavenly-c.v001.n037 ---------------
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-------------- BEGIN heavenly-c.v001.n038 --------------
001 - Bryan Woodworth <bryanw@6 - pan/scan/lbox; missing blood
002 - Bryan Woodworth <bryanw@6 - domain info
003 - michaela drapes <oleanna@ - more pan and scan injustices...
004 - orson@CAM.ORG (Jean Gueri - Re: pan/scan/lbox; missing blood
005 - mailcall <mailcall@kiva.n - Re: Digest heavenly-c.v001.n037
006 - Donald Chin <donaldc@nets - Re: Introduction & HC opinions...
007 - adamabr@asterix.helix.net -
008 - "Jefferson F. Morris" <jf - 'Creatures' and 'Kane'
009 - Bryan Woodworth <bryanw@6 - "Sister My Sister"
010 - eireann1@qnet.com (none l - Re: "Sister My Sister"
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n038.1 ---------------
From: Bryan Woodworth <bryanw@666.org>
Subject: pan/scan/lbox; missing blood
Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 01:39:28 -0700 (PDT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Length: 3581
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Dear subscribers,
Two portions --
* comparison of pan/scan - laserdisc
* blood in the bowl?
As someone who has seen both the pan/scan (on video) and letterbox
versions (on video and laserdisc), let me say, unreservedly, that..
P A N A N D S C A N I S I N F E R I O R ! ! !
The most glaring deficit is the complete injustice done to Melanie
Lynskey. It seems it is always she who is cropped out of key scenes or
left just out of the reach of the camera, on the pan/scan version.
Item: Pauline visits Juliet in the hospital for the
first time. Pauline and Juliet embrace and
squeal with delight. Camera shot from behind
Juliet/Pauline as Honora runs up saying, "Don't
get too close, she's still not 100%!"
INJUSTICE: Pauline's radiant smile and
expressive eyes (on the far right of the
screen) are not seen in the p/s version.
Item: Pauline goes on holiday to Port Levy with the
Hulmes. Hilda just finishes combing Pauline's
hair.
INJUSTICE: Pauline rushes up to Juliet. The pair
giggles with glee, clasps hands, and looks to
Hilda for approval. In the p/s version, Pauline,
AGAIN on the far right of the screen, is partially
chopped off (we see part of her arm, and a little of
her body).
Those are two glaring atrocities :-) which come to mind.
Anyone who has seen the p/s and lbox versions can corroborate my
findings.
--
Another point I'd like to bring up.. When I first saw "HC" on STARZ!
(a pay-channel in the USA, somewhat like a bargain-basement HBO or
Cinemax), I saw something which I haven't seen in any version since.
I shall first describe what I saw when I first saw the STARZ! broadcast
(the very first time I saw "HC"; it was a pan/scan broadcast).
This scene takes place after Juliet has been diagnosed with TB, is in the
hospital, and Pauline thinks things over at the dinner table.
Pauline speaks of the "brainwave" she has, whereby she and Juliet compose
letters to one another. Juliet speaks about how she is languishing away,
"in this house of decrepitude." As that line is uttered (or closely
thereto) the camera zooms in on an old man, hunched over a bowl of some
sort, as if about to vomit.
This here is the interesting part: I am very certain that I saw
the old man begin to cough up blood into the bowl! It was a shocking
image which emboldened Juliet's comment about this being a "house of
decrepitude."
In every version I've seen since (including the letterbox airing on
STARZ!, the commercial U.S. pan/scan video, and the commercial U.S.
letterbox), the scene is cut RIGHT BEFORE THE MAN coughs up blood into
the bowl.
My question: Has anyone else seen this minor detail? Have you seen the
blood as well?
I was sure I saw it. However, it WAS late at night, so perhaps my mind
was playing tricks on me. If this wasn't in the film, Peter Jackson made
a mistake, as that surely would have strengthened it (if even only
minutely).
One theory I have is that STARZ's original airing, the first screening of
"HC" I ever saw, was perhaps a non-U.S. version (perhaps UK, or
something?).
Looking forward to hearing from you, to learn whether or not I am
experiencing delusions.. :)
Best regards,
Bryan Woodworth
Moderator
Heavenly Creatures Mailing List
--
"'Tis indeed a miracle, one must feel,
that two such heavenly creatures are real." bryan woodworth
-- "Heavenly Creatures," 1994 bryanw@borovnia.666.org
http://www.reflection.org/heavenly/
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n038.2 ---------------
From: Bryan Woodworth <bryanw@666.org>
Subject: domain info
Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 02:03:34 -0700 (PDT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Length: 695
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Hi,
Per Michael's request --
---------------------------
LIST SUBSCRIBER DATA
Table 1 -- Listed by domain (alphabetical order)
au 6
ca 2
com 9
de 1
edu 9
fi 1
gr 1
net 4
nz 2
org 4
uk 1
--------
40 subscribers
Table 2 -- Listed by frequency (highest to lowest)
com 9
edu 9
au 6
net 4
org 4
ca 2
nz 2
de 1
fi 1
gr 1
uk 1
--------
40 subscribers
---------------------------
Best regards,
Bryan Woodworth
Moderator
Heavenly Creatures Mailing List
--
"'Tis indeed a miracle, one must feel,
that two such heavenly creatures are real." bryan woodworth
-- "Heavenly Creatures," 1994 bryanw@borovnia.666.org
http://www.reflection.org/heavenly/
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n038.3 ---------------
From: michaela drapes <oleanna@mail.utexas.edu>
Subject: more pan and scan injustices...
Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 04:00:31 -0600
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
more things chopped all to bits by the pan and scan version of HC:
When Pauline cycles to Ilam the first time, as she passes through the gate,
there is a little sign that says 'Ilam.' This is chopped off in the P&S
version. As a certain person who is rather close to me (you know who you
are, darling... (; ) and I decided, if you have only seen the P&S version,
you have no clue what Ilam is...unless you've read the FAQ or are obsessed
with the film, or something... (;
In the aria scene, when the bushes, buildings, etc. behind Pauline's head
darken and dissolve/morph to Juliet on the balcony, but Pauline's head is
still the main focus of the shot. In the P&S, you see the sky behind
Pauline darken, and then there is a pan to Juliet on the balcony. This is
by far one of my favourite moments in the film, and it wasn't until I saw
the letterboxed version did I really appreciate its true genius... (:
regards,
michaela, whose birthday is the day *before* Pauline's... (:
--
Michaela R. Drapes
oleanna@mail.utexas.edu
NEW URL! http://www2.cibola.net/~michaela
Will do WWW design for Atomic Fireballs.
--
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n038.4 ---------------
From: orson@CAM.ORG (Jean Guerin)
Subject: Re: pan/scan/lbox; missing blood
Date: Sun, 26 May 1996 06:12:38 -0400
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>My question: Has anyone else seen this minor detail? Have you seen the
>blood as well?
The bald patient coughs up a big spatter of blood in the NZ cut.
E. Jean Guerin
Director of Programming
FANT-ASIA Film Festival
Montreal, Canada
also: Film Critic (HOUR magazine) & Journalist (Cinefantastique)
Cult/Trash Cinema specialist (CBC-Radio's Brave New Waves)
Actor (_Heavenly Creatures_,_Frankenstein & Me_,_La Vengeance de la
Femme en Noir_)
The critics rave!
"The Most Hideous Man Alive"
-Kate Winslet, Academy Award Nominee
"Sexy Demon"
-TIME Magazine.
orson@cam.org
http://www.cam.org/~orson/index.html
==============================================================================
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n038.5 ---------------
From: mailcall <mailcall@kiva.net>
Subject: Re: Digest heavenly-c.v001.n037
Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 06:31:19 -0500 (EST)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
: -- Juliet now welcomes you to the main page (through the
: magic of a 40k, automatically-playing audio clip). I welcome feedback
: on this...
i bet you've got her saying "i'm soo happy to see -you-!!!" but i will
have to imagine it.
: -- Two new additions on the sounds page - short and sweet, they make great
: startup sounds (which is how I use them!). "I'm going to the Fourth
: World", and "That's _so_ impressive!"
i've got to get a sound card. it's becoming an absolute necessity. i think
computers shouldn't only give error messages. (dos never says "good
command or filename") i'd love to hear "aren't -you- clever!" every time i
finish editing a file.
in other news:
: Unfortunately, my damn VCR decided to screw up, so
: there is this smear at the top of the screen which blinks on and
: off at random.
the first time i settled in to watch heavenly creatures for the first
time, my vcr promptly blew a fuse. sigh.
*--==--==--*love is real*--==--*imagine*--==--==--*remember*--==--==--*
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n038.6 ---------------
From: Donald Chin <donaldc@netspace.net.au>
Subject: Re: Introduction & HC opinions...
Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 21:54:52 +1000
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hi all,
"Jefferson F. Morris" <jfmorris@CapAccess.org> wrote...
> In my experience, most people who see HC admire it in some way (It was a
> critical hit, after all), but they're not completely enraptured and
> thrilled the way I was. So people hear me drone on and on about how
> fantastic the film is, how it was the best movie of '94 (Yes, better than
> Pulp Fiction, which I also loved), how it's one of the best films ever
> made, blah blah. But then when I try to introduce them to it, I usually
> end up qualifying my praise by saying that "Most people will like it, but
> they won't necessarily love it the way I do."
I raved on about Heavenly Creatures to the people where I work. They didn't
understand me at all. But then again, I didn't think that they would have
been the type of people who would have been fanatical about anything. None
of them saw it, even after my rave. My friends saw it after I told them
about it. One of them thought the film wasn't good because it didn't show
what happened to the girls after the murder. She wanted a court case
scenario. I think she may have missed some of the point of the film.
Another couple of friends felt that Kate Winslet was too "wild" and "over
the top". They felt the subject matter was rather grim as well. People do
seem to see them film in quite different ways.
> I guess I don't want to raise their hopes too stratospherically high.
> I'm one of those possessive film fans who takes the attitude of "You insult
> my movies, you insult me." I guess I need to loosen up.
I tend to do the same now. When their view of the film isn't the same as
mine, I tend to be a little annoyed. I get the urge to query them on every
aspect of the film as to why they have reached their viewpoint.
On a slightly different note, I have just seen a critical view of Citizen
Kane by Robert McKee. The critic basically went through the film and
explained why Citizen Kane shouldn't been hailed as the best film ever
made. He seemed quite the critic's critic. His views were quite reasonable.
All the while I was watching it, I kept thinking if Heavenly Creatures
could have passed the criticisms he made of CK. Personally I felt it may
have - but then again, I'm not a film critic and really wouldn't know. I
wonder what Jean G thinks since he is a film critic and the closest person
I know of associated to Orson Welles.
Has anyone else seen that piece by Robert McKee? People living in
Australia may have seen this special as it was on ABC-TV.
Regards, Donald
--
Donald Chin <donaldc@netspace.net.au>
"Lost somewhere in Australia...
and fanatical about Heavenly Creatures and Jane Austen!"
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n038.7 ---------------
From: adamabr@asterix.helix.net (Adam Abrams)
Subject:
Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 14:19:11 -0800
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
To Chris, and the others who missed out on the letterboxed version ...
>I also prefer to buy/rent the letter-box edition of movies, but since
>it took me long enough to get ahold of this movie in p&s, I was just
>happy to get that. :-)
>
>And if I only had a laser disc player. *sighs wistfully* Oh well,
>I'll have to keep my eye out for the letterbox edition so I can pick
>it up. :-)
...just do what I did - rent a videodisc player for an evening and dub the
widescreen disc to a VHS tape! I own the disc, but it's on tape that I am
able to actually watch it.
Later,
Adam
==========================================================================
Only the best people fight against Adam Abrams
all obstacles... in pursuit of happiness! Vancouver, BC, Canada
--Juliet Hulme, "Heavenly Creatures"
*Visit the "Fourth World" at http://www.helix.net/~adamabr/creatures.html*
==========================================================================
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n038.8 ---------------
From: "Jefferson F. Morris" <jfmorris@CapAccess.org>
Subject: 'Creatures' and 'Kane'
Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 18:11:40 -0400 (EDT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
On Mon, 27 May 1996, Donald Chin wrote:
> I raved on about Heavenly Creatures to the people where I work. They didn't
> understand me at all. But then again, I didn't think that they would have
> been the type of people who would have been fanatical about anything.
I think you've got to have a little passionate, romantic streak in you to
really plug into this film. And you've also got to be able to hear Mario
Lanza songs without your brain being fried ("Wait...old song...no
guitars...no drum machine...Does not compute!")
> One of them thought the film wasn't good because it didn't show
> what happened to the girls after the murder. She wanted a court case
> scenario. I think she may have missed some of the point of the film.
She must've been watching too much O.J. coverage. Thing is,
with all the sensationalism of the original trial, a competent filmmaker
could probably make an engrossing film about the events after the
murder. But that would be the more conventional film that Jackson and
Walsh chose not to make.
> Another couple of friends felt that Kate Winslet was too "wild" and "over
> the top".
What fools men (or women) are. It seems clear to me that your friends are
malfunctioning. You might want to have them looked at by a professional.
> On a slightly different note, I have just seen a critical view of Citizen
> Kane by Robert McKee. The critic basically went through the film and
> explained why Citizen Kane shouldn't been hailed as the best film ever
> made. He seemed quite the critic's critic. His views were quite reasonable.
Interesting. I'm a fan of CK, but not a fanatic. While I appreciate the
astounding innovations taking place in every scene, I certainly wouldn't
call it my favorite movie. Just as a matter of personal taste. I'd be
interested in hearing what McKee had to say.
--Jefferson
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n038.9 ---------------
From: Bryan Woodworth <bryanw@666.org>
Subject: "Sister My Sister"
Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 16:50:57 -0700 (PDT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
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Content-Length: 2142
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Dear subscribers,
Some time ago, Sarah Packard ("Abbagirl") mentioned the film "Sister My
Sister" on the HC chat zone. I was intrigued by her comments and yearned
for the day when I would be able to view this movie.
Rapture! This day did arrive last week. Fortunately for me, Cinemax (a
pay cable channel based in the USA) showed this film late one evening. I
recorded it, as I was doing upgrades to HeavenlyWeb at the time. :-)
A few days later, I relaxed on my sofa and watched this film.
Intro: "Sister My Sister" is the story (set in the 1930s, I believe) of
two sisters who work as servants (maids?) for a rather supercilious
old woman (played masterfully by Julie Walters). Over time, the elder
sister transforms in a most interesting way, causing the film to end in
tragedy and despair.
Review:
Plot: A somewhat interesting story, but it doesn't suck you in like
"Heavenly Creatures" does. I didn't expect it to. However, there are
some parallels with "HC" (intense relationship, living in a "pressure
cooker" environment, a tragic end) which compelled me to draw comparisons,
when I probably shouldn't have done so.
Characters: Interesting characters, but again, not as intriguing as in
"HC".
Soundtrack: Bleah. So-so. Not very moving. I didn't pay attention to
the score for most of the film.
Direction: It was somewhat standard, not at all distracting or very
interesting.
Overall: This movie was a bit of a disappointment. I didn't care for
the characters; the pace of the movie was very slow; and, most of all, I
didn't feel this film had much to say. It seemed a bit formulaic.
Rating (0 to 4 pink gemstones): 2 (middling fare, perhaps worthy of a
latenight viewing)
I search in vain for another film to rouse my being as "HC" did. Could
be a long wait!
Dissenting opinions expected and encouraged.
Best regards,
Bryan Woodworth
Moderator
Heavenly Creatures Mailing List
--
"'Tis indeed a miracle, one must feel,
that two such heavenly creatures are real." bryan woodworth
-- "Heavenly Creatures," 1994 bryanw@borovnia.666.org
http://www.reflection.org/heavenly/
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n038.10 ---------------
From: eireann1@qnet.com (none listed)
Subject: Re: "Sister My Sister"
Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 17:18:30 -0700 (PDT)
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
I saw SMS on one of the pay channels the other day, too, for the first time;
being a semi-fan of Joely Richardson, I tried to watch it, but... well, it
wasn't as tedious as Heaven's Prisoners, at least...
>Characters: Interesting characters, but again, not as intriguing as in
>"HC".
I didn't think the two sisters were interesting at all, despite Richardson's
performance; Walters was the only character that even interested me
marginally...
>Soundtrack: Bleah. So-so. Not very moving. I didn't pay attention to
>the score for most of the film.
It was quite dull, I thought; completely unremarkable.
>I search in vain for another film to rouse my being as "HC" did. Could
>be a long wait!
Have you seen Bill Forsyth's excellent film _Housekeeping_? If you haven't,
it stars Christine Lahti as a rather eccentric aunt who comes to a small
town in the
Pacific Northwest to look after her two orphaned nieces, Lucille and Ruthie.
Both girls are enthusiastic when Sylvie (Lahti's character) comes at first,
but then Lucille becomes irritated by the way Sylvie is, and becomes
obsessed with doing things the "normal" way. Ruthie, OTOH, is drawn closer
to Sylvie, and...it's just a beautiful film, the study of how the characters
affect one another. HC level, in my book, but some other HC fans have
suggested that that's going a little overboard.
EB
--
"You're not anybody in America unless you're on TV. On TV is where we learn
about who we really are. Because what's the point in doing anything
worthwhile if nobody's watching? And if people are watching, it makes you a
better person."
-Suzanne Stone (Nicole Kidman), _To Die For_
--------------- END heavenly-c.v001.n038 ---------------
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-------------- BEGIN heavenly-c.v001.n039 --------------
001 - michaela drapes <oleanna@ - Re: "Sister My Sister"
002 - adamabr@asterix.helix.net - Re: blood in the bowl
003 - 9506148v@Magpie.Magill.Un - Re: The Holy Grail
004 - Mark Somerville <msomervi - Re: Digest heavenly-c.v001.n038
005 - Tim Baglio <raven@nas.com - Re: Digest heavenly-c.v001.n038
006 - Marco Thorbruegge <marco. - Re: The Holy Grail
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n039.1 ---------------
From: michaela drapes <oleanna@mail.utexas.edu>
Subject: Re: "Sister My Sister"
Date: Tue, 28 May 1996 01:04:48 -0600
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
I saw SMS about 3 months into my HC craze...and had a glorious time playing
"Find the HC parallels" through the whole thing...made it quite more
enjoyable. (: (I mean...the entire first few minutes are completely ripped
from opening of HC, without any of the effectiveness.) Overall, I would rate
the film as rather fair to middling, although I did find one sequence very
interesting.
This little explaination contains what could be construed as spoilers, so if
you haven't seen SMS, and don't want to have any of it spoilt for you,
*don't read this bit*! (:
>Direction: It was somewhat standard, not at all distracting or very
>interesting.
I found the lovemaking in the pantry/double solitare game/faucet dripping
sequence to be very effective in promoting the foil relationships of the
sisters and the mother and daughter. I remember little else about the film
other than this bit. I suppose the overall effectiveness of it does fall on
the editor, as the quick cuts between two concurrent events hightens the
intensity of the whole sequence. I remember being highly disappointed that
the energy level of the film severely drops after such a heady buildup of
tension. I have a feeling that this may have stemmed from Nancy Meckler's
inexperience in directing film (she is a highly regarded theater director,
however), since, in my opinion, on stage it is much easier carry dramatic
tension from scene to scene. There is much more audience investment in the
story when it is being played out live, and I feel that perhaps Meckler was
not sure how to transfer this into film.
just my thoughts,
regards,
michaela
--
Michaela R. Drapes
oleanna@mail.utexas.edu
NEW URL! http://www2.cibola.net/~michaela
Will do WWW design for Atomic Fireballs.
--
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n039.2 ---------------
From: adamabr@asterix.helix.net (Adam Abrams)
Subject: Re: blood in the bowl
Date: Tue, 28 May 1996 01:31:25 -0800
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hi, all!
>This here is the interesting part: I am very certain that I saw
>the old man begin to cough up blood into the bowl! It was a shocking
>image which emboldened Juliet's comment about this being a "house of
>decrepitude."
>
>In every version I've seen since (including the letterbox airing on
>STARZ!, the commercial U.S. pan/scan video, and the commercial U.S.
>letterbox), the scene is cut RIGHT BEFORE THE MAN coughs up blood
Never saw the "bloody" version, 8^( but as one with a healthy obsession
with the film, I recall having a specific thought about this very shot
early on. I expected something unpleasant to come out, and was rather
relieved when it didn't. (I have a low tolerance for spitting, throwing up,
etc. in films... as indeed in real life! 8^) )
Even without yet knowing of Jackson's desire to totally avoid the
upleasant-bodily-fluids elements of his earlier films, I still assumed that
it was a conscious decision to keep this sequence on the tasteful side.
(Lord knows any other H'wood flick would hardly hesitate to leave nothing
to our imaginings.) At any rate, it was quite effective without it - all
that hacking and coughing... eww....
Adam
==========================================================================
Only the best people fight against Adam Abrams
all obstacles... in pursuit of happiness! Vancouver, BC, Canada
--Juliet Hulme, "Heavenly Creatures"
*Visit the "Fourth World" at http://www.helix.net/~adamabr/creatures.html*
==========================================================================
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n039.3 ---------------
From: 9506148v@Magpie.Magill.UniSA.edu.au
Subject: Re: The Holy Grail
Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 00:13:11 +0930
I've just finished sending an email to Miramax about the long lost
directors cut of HC. I noticed, after sending my message, that only three
people have acknowledged sending similar pleas to Miramax. Now, I live in
Australia, and I can (I've been told) walk into any video store and hire
this much-sought-after video. However, I have also been told that folks in
other corners of the world are not so fortunate.
So, if you want to see this video get a world-wide release, please write
to Miramax. There is a link to Miramax, making it terribly easy, from the
HC FAQ website.
Shannon.
ps. Has anyone seen the Kate Winslet photo shoot in Premiere magazine?
I was very disappointed. I guess I'm too much of a purist, but I
preferred the romantic (and clothed) femme fatale image portrayed in
HC. Oh well. I hope Hollywood doesn't go to her head.
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n039.4 ---------------
From: Mark Somerville <msomervi@kimberlite.wwonline.com>
Subject: Re: Digest heavenly-c.v001.n038
Date: Tue, 28 May 1996 20:49:19 -0400 (EDT)
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
At 17:16 27/05/96 -0700, you wrote:
>
>-------------- BEGIN heavenly-c.v001.n038 --------------
>
> 001 - Bryan Woodworth <bryanw@6 - pan/scan/lbox; missing blood
> 002 - Bryan Woodworth <bryanw@6 - domain info
> 003 - michaela drapes <oleanna@ - more pan and scan injustices...
> 004 - orson@CAM.ORG (Jean Gueri - Re: pan/scan/lbox; missing blood
> 005 - mailcall <mailcall@kiva.n - Re: Digest heavenly-c.v001.n037
> 006 - Donald Chin <donaldc@nets - Re: Introduction & HC opinions...
> 007 - adamabr@asterix.helix.net -
> 008 - "Jefferson F. Morris" <jf - 'Creatures' and 'Kane'
> 009 - Bryan Woodworth <bryanw@6 - "Sister My Sister"
> 010 - eireann1@qnet.com (none l - Re: "Sister My Sister"
>
>--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n038.1 ---------------
>
>From: Bryan Woodworth <bryanw@666.org>
>Subject: pan/scan/lbox; missing blood
>Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 01:39:28 -0700 (PDT)
>MIME-Version: 1.0
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
>Content-Length: 3581
>Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
>
>Dear subscribers,
>
>Two portions --
>* comparison of pan/scan - laserdisc
>* blood in the bowl?
>
>
>
>As someone who has seen both the pan/scan (on video) and letterbox
>versions (on video and laserdisc), let me say, unreservedly, that..
>
> P A N A N D S C A N I S I N F E R I O R ! ! !
>
>The most glaring deficit is the complete injustice done to Melanie
>Lynskey. It seems it is always she who is cropped out of key scenes or
>left just out of the reach of the camera, on the pan/scan version.
>
> Item: Pauline visits Juliet in the hospital for the
> first time. Pauline and Juliet embrace and
> squeal with delight. Camera shot from behind
> Juliet/Pauline as Honora runs up saying, "Don't
> get too close, she's still not 100%!"
>
> INJUSTICE: Pauline's radiant smile and
> expressive eyes (on the far right of the
> screen) are not seen in the p/s version.
>
> Item: Pauline goes on holiday to Port Levy with the
> Hulmes. Hilda just finishes combing Pauline's
> hair.
>
> INJUSTICE: Pauline rushes up to Juliet. The pair
> giggles with glee, clasps hands, and looks to
> Hilda for approval. In the p/s version, Pauline,
> AGAIN on the far right of the screen, is partially
> chopped off (we see part of her arm, and a little of
> her body).
>
>
>Those are two glaring atrocities :-) which come to mind.
>
>Anyone who has seen the p/s and lbox versions can corroborate my
>findings.
>
>--
>
>Another point I'd like to bring up.. When I first saw "HC" on STARZ!
>(a pay-channel in the USA, somewhat like a bargain-basement HBO or
>Cinemax), I saw something which I haven't seen in any version since.
>
>I shall first describe what I saw when I first saw the STARZ! broadcast
>(the very first time I saw "HC"; it was a pan/scan broadcast).
>
>This scene takes place after Juliet has been diagnosed with TB, is in the
>hospital, and Pauline thinks things over at the dinner table.
>
>Pauline speaks of the "brainwave" she has, whereby she and Juliet compose
>letters to one another. Juliet speaks about how she is languishing away,
>"in this house of decrepitude." As that line is uttered (or closely
>thereto) the camera zooms in on an old man, hunched over a bowl of some
>sort, as if about to vomit.
>
>This here is the interesting part: I am very certain that I saw
>the old man begin to cough up blood into the bowl! It was a shocking
>image which emboldened Juliet's comment about this being a "house of
>decrepitude."
>
>In every version I've seen since (including the letterbox airing on
>STARZ!, the commercial U.S. pan/scan video, and the commercial U.S.
>letterbox), the scene is cut RIGHT BEFORE THE MAN coughs up blood into
>the bowl.
>
>My question: Has anyone else seen this minor detail? Have you seen the
>blood as well?
>
>I was sure I saw it. However, it WAS late at night, so perhaps my mind
>was playing tricks on me. If this wasn't in the film, Peter Jackson made
>a mistake, as that surely would have strengthened it (if even only
>minutely).
>
>One theory I have is that STARZ's original airing, the first screening of
>"HC" I ever saw, was perhaps a non-U.S. version (perhaps UK, or
>something?).
>
>Looking forward to hearing from you, to learn whether or not I am
>experiencing delusions.. :)
>
>
>Best regards,
>
>Bryan Woodworth
>Moderator
>Heavenly Creatures Mailing List
>
>--
>"'Tis indeed a miracle, one must feel,
> that two such heavenly creatures are real." bryan woodworth
> -- "Heavenly Creatures," 1994 bryanw@borovnia.666.org
> http://www.reflection.org/heavenly/
>
>
>--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n038.2 ---------------
>
>From: Bryan Woodworth <bryanw@666.org>
>Subject: domain info
>Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 02:03:34 -0700 (PDT)
>MIME-Version: 1.0
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
>Content-Length: 695
>Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
>
>Hi,
>
>Per Michael's request --
>
>
>---------------------------
>LIST SUBSCRIBER DATA
>
>Table 1 -- Listed by domain (alphabetical order)
>
>au 6
>ca 2
>com 9
>de 1
>edu 9
>fi 1
>gr 1
>net 4
>nz 2
>org 4
>uk 1
>--------
> 40 subscribers
>
>Table 2 -- Listed by frequency (highest to lowest)
>
>com 9
>edu 9
>au 6
>net 4
>org 4
>ca 2
>nz 2
>de 1
>fi 1
>gr 1
>uk 1
>--------
> 40 subscribers
>
>
>---------------------------
>
>Best regards,
>
>Bryan Woodworth
>Moderator
>Heavenly Creatures Mailing List
>
>--
>"'Tis indeed a miracle, one must feel,
> that two such heavenly creatures are real." bryan woodworth
> -- "Heavenly Creatures," 1994 bryanw@borovnia.666.org
> http://www.reflection.org/heavenly/
>
>
>--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n038.3 ---------------
>
>From: michaela drapes <oleanna@mail.utexas.edu>
>Subject: more pan and scan injustices...
>Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 04:00:31 -0600
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
>more things chopped all to bits by the pan and scan version of HC:
>
>When Pauline cycles to Ilam the first time, as she passes through the gate,
>there is a little sign that says 'Ilam.' This is chopped off in the P&S
>version. As a certain person who is rather close to me (you know who you
>are, darling... (; ) and I decided, if you have only seen the P&S version,
>you have no clue what Ilam is...unless you've read the FAQ or are obsessed
>with the film, or something... (;
>
>In the aria scene, when the bushes, buildings, etc. behind Pauline's head
>darken and dissolve/morph to Juliet on the balcony, but Pauline's head is
>still the main focus of the shot. In the P&S, you see the sky behind
>Pauline darken, and then there is a pan to Juliet on the balcony. This is
>by far one of my favourite moments in the film, and it wasn't until I saw
>the letterboxed version did I really appreciate its true genius... (:
>
>regards,
>michaela, whose birthday is the day *before* Pauline's... (:
>--
>Michaela R. Drapes
>oleanna@mail.utexas.edu
>NEW URL! http://www2.cibola.net/~michaela
>Will do WWW design for Atomic Fireballs.
>--
>
>
>
>--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n038.4 ---------------
>
>From: orson@CAM.ORG (Jean Guerin)
>Subject: Re: pan/scan/lbox; missing blood
>Date: Sun, 26 May 1996 06:12:38 -0400
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
>
>>My question: Has anyone else seen this minor detail? Have you seen the
>>blood as well?
>
>The bald patient coughs up a big spatter of blood in the NZ cut.
>
>E. Jean Guerin
>
>Director of Programming
>FANT-ASIA Film Festival
>Montreal, Canada
>
>also: Film Critic (HOUR magazine) & Journalist (Cinefantastique)
> Cult/Trash Cinema specialist (CBC-Radio's Brave New Waves)
> Actor (_Heavenly Creatures_,_Frankenstein & Me_,_La Vengeance de la
>
> Femme en Noir_)
>
>The critics rave!
>
>"The Most Hideous Man Alive"
> -Kate Winslet, Academy Award Nominee
>
>"Sexy Demon"
> -TIME Magazine.
>
>orson@cam.org
>http://www.cam.org/~orson/index.html
>==============================================================================
>
>
>
>
>
>
>--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n038.5 ---------------
>
>From: mailcall <mailcall@kiva.net>
>Subject: Re: Digest heavenly-c.v001.n037
>Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 06:31:19 -0500 (EST)
>MIME-Version: 1.0
>Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
>
>: -- Juliet now welcomes you to the main page (through the
>: magic of a 40k, automatically-playing audio clip). I welcome feedback
>: on this...
>
>i bet you've got her saying "i'm soo happy to see -you-!!!" but i will
>have to imagine it.
>
>: -- Two new additions on the sounds page - short and sweet, they make great
>: startup sounds (which is how I use them!). "I'm going to the Fourth
>: World", and "That's _so_ impressive!"
>
>i've got to get a sound card. it's becoming an absolute necessity. i think
>computers shouldn't only give error messages. (dos never says "good
>command or filename") i'd love to hear "aren't -you- clever!" every time i
>finish editing a file.
>
>in other news:
>
>: Unfortunately, my damn VCR decided to screw up, so
>: there is this smear at the top of the screen which blinks on and
>: off at random.
>
>the first time i settled in to watch heavenly creatures for the first
>time, my vcr promptly blew a fuse. sigh.
>
>*--==--==--*love is real*--==--*imagine*--==--==--*remember*--==--==--*
>
>
>
>
>--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n038.6 ---------------
>
>From: Donald Chin <donaldc@netspace.net.au>
>Subject: Re: Introduction & HC opinions...
>Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 21:54:52 +1000
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
>Hi all,
>
>"Jefferson F. Morris" <jfmorris@CapAccess.org> wrote...
>
>> In my experience, most people who see HC admire it in some way (It was a
>> critical hit, after all), but they're not completely enraptured and
>> thrilled the way I was. So people hear me drone on and on about how
>> fantastic the film is, how it was the best movie of '94 (Yes, better than
>> Pulp Fiction, which I also loved), how it's one of the best films ever
>> made, blah blah. But then when I try to introduce them to it, I usually
>> end up qualifying my praise by saying that "Most people will like it, but
>> they won't necessarily love it the way I do."
>
>I raved on about Heavenly Creatures to the people where I work. They didn't
>understand me at all. But then again, I didn't think that they would have
>been the type of people who would have been fanatical about anything. None
>of them saw it, even after my rave. My friends saw it after I told them
>about it. One of them thought the film wasn't good because it didn't show
>what happened to the girls after the murder. She wanted a court case
>scenario. I think she may have missed some of the point of the film.
>Another couple of friends felt that Kate Winslet was too "wild" and "over
>the top". They felt the subject matter was rather grim as well. People do
>seem to see them film in quite different ways.
>
>> I guess I don't want to raise their hopes too stratospherically high.
>> I'm one of those possessive film fans who takes the attitude of "You insult
>> my movies, you insult me." I guess I need to loosen up.
>
>I tend to do the same now. When their view of the film isn't the same as
>mine, I tend to be a little annoyed. I get the urge to query them on every
>aspect of the film as to why they have reached their viewpoint.
>
>On a slightly different note, I have just seen a critical view of Citizen
>Kane by Robert McKee. The critic basically went through the film and
>explained why Citizen Kane shouldn't been hailed as the best film ever
>made. He seemed quite the critic's critic. His views were quite reasonable.
>All the while I was watching it, I kept thinking if Heavenly Creatures
>could have passed the criticisms he made of CK. Personally I felt it may
>have - but then again, I'm not a film critic and really wouldn't know. I
>wonder what Jean G thinks since he is a film critic and the closest person
>I know of associated to Orson Welles.
>
>Has anyone else seen that piece by Robert McKee? People living in
>Australia may have seen this special as it was on ABC-TV.
>
>Regards, Donald
>
>--
>Donald Chin <donaldc@netspace.net.au>
> "Lost somewhere in Australia...
> and fanatical about Heavenly Creatures and Jane Austen!"
>
>
>
>
>--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n038.7 ---------------
>
>From: adamabr@asterix.helix.net (Adam Abrams)
>Subject:
>Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 14:19:11 -0800
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
>To Chris, and the others who missed out on the letterboxed version ...
>
>>I also prefer to buy/rent the letter-box edition of movies, but since
>>it took me long enough to get ahold of this movie in p&s, I was just
>>happy to get that. :-)
>>
>>And if I only had a laser disc player. *sighs wistfully* Oh well,
>>I'll have to keep my eye out for the letterbox edition so I can pick
>>it up. :-)
>
>
>...just do what I did - rent a videodisc player for an evening and dub the
>widescreen disc to a VHS tape! I own the disc, but it's on tape that I am
>able to actually watch it.
>
>Later,
>Adam
>
>==========================================================================
>Only the best people fight against Adam Abrams
>all obstacles... in pursuit of happiness! Vancouver, BC, Canada
>--Juliet Hulme, "Heavenly Creatures"
>*Visit the "Fourth World" at http://www.helix.net/~adamabr/creatures.html*
>==========================================================================
>
>
>
>
>--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n038.8 ---------------
>
>From: "Jefferson F. Morris" <jfmorris@CapAccess.org>
>Subject: 'Creatures' and 'Kane'
>Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 18:11:40 -0400 (EDT)
>MIME-Version: 1.0
>Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
>
>On Mon, 27 May 1996, Donald Chin wrote:
>
>> I raved on about Heavenly Creatures to the people where I work. They didn't
>> understand me at all. But then again, I didn't think that they would have
>> been the type of people who would have been fanatical about anything.
>
>I think you've got to have a little passionate, romantic streak in you to
>really plug into this film. And you've also got to be able to hear Mario
>Lanza songs without your brain being fried ("Wait...old song...no
>guitars...no drum machine...Does not compute!")
>
>> One of them thought the film wasn't good because it didn't show
>> what happened to the girls after the murder. She wanted a court case
>> scenario. I think she may have missed some of the point of the film.
>
>She must've been watching too much O.J. coverage. Thing is,
>with all the sensationalism of the original trial, a competent filmmaker
>could probably make an engrossing film about the events after the
>murder. But that would be the more conventional film that Jackson and
>Walsh chose not to make.
>
>> Another couple of friends felt that Kate Winslet was too "wild" and "over
>> the top".
>
>What fools men (or women) are. It seems clear to me that your friends are
>malfunctioning. You might want to have them looked at by a professional.
>
>> On a slightly different note, I have just seen a critical view of Citizen
>> Kane by Robert McKee. The critic basically went through the film and
>> explained why Citizen Kane shouldn't been hailed as the best film ever
>> made. He seemed quite the critic's critic. His views were quite reasonable.
>
>Interesting. I'm a fan of CK, but not a fanatic. While I appreciate the
>astounding innovations taking place in every scene, I certainly wouldn't
>call it my favorite movie. Just as a matter of personal taste. I'd be
>interested in hearing what McKee had to say.
>
> --Jefferson
>
>
>--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n038.9 ---------------
>
>From: Bryan Woodworth <bryanw@666.org>
>Subject: "Sister My Sister"
>Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 16:50:57 -0700 (PDT)
>MIME-Version: 1.0
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
>Content-Length: 2142
>Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
>
>Dear subscribers,
>
>Some time ago, Sarah Packard ("Abbagirl") mentioned the film "Sister My
>Sister" on the HC chat zone. I was intrigued by her comments and yearned
>for the day when I would be able to view this movie.
>
>Rapture! This day did arrive last week. Fortunately for me, Cinemax (a
>pay cable channel based in the USA) showed this film late one evening. I
>recorded it, as I was doing upgrades to HeavenlyWeb at the time. :-)
>
>A few days later, I relaxed on my sofa and watched this film.
>
>Intro: "Sister My Sister" is the story (set in the 1930s, I believe) of
>two sisters who work as servants (maids?) for a rather supercilious
>old woman (played masterfully by Julie Walters). Over time, the elder
>sister transforms in a most interesting way, causing the film to end in
>tragedy and despair.
>
>Review:
>
>Plot: A somewhat interesting story, but it doesn't suck you in like
>"Heavenly Creatures" does. I didn't expect it to. However, there are
>some parallels with "HC" (intense relationship, living in a "pressure
>cooker" environment, a tragic end) which compelled me to draw comparisons,
>when I probably shouldn't have done so.
>
>Characters: Interesting characters, but again, not as intriguing as in
>"HC".
>
>Soundtrack: Bleah. So-so. Not very moving. I didn't pay attention to
>the score for most of the film.
>
>Direction: It was somewhat standard, not at all distracting or very
>interesting.
>
>Overall: This movie was a bit of a disappointment. I didn't care for
>the characters; the pace of the movie was very slow; and, most of all, I
>didn't feel this film had much to say. It seemed a bit formulaic.
>
>Rating (0 to 4 pink gemstones): 2 (middling fare, perhaps worthy of a
>latenight viewing)
>
>I search in vain for another film to rouse my being as "HC" did. Could
>be a long wait!
>
>Dissenting opinions expected and encouraged.
>
>
>Best regards,
>
>Bryan Woodworth
>Moderator
>Heavenly Creatures Mailing List
>
>
>--
>"'Tis indeed a miracle, one must feel,
> that two such heavenly creatures are real." bryan woodworth
> -- "Heavenly Creatures," 1994 bryanw@borovnia.666.org
> http://www.reflection.org/heavenly/
>
>
>--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n038.10 ---------------
>
>From: eireann1@qnet.com (none listed)
>Subject: Re: "Sister My Sister"
>Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 17:18:30 -0700 (PDT)
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
>
>I saw SMS on one of the pay channels the other day, too, for the first time;
>being a semi-fan of Joely Richardson, I tried to watch it, but... well, it
>wasn't as tedious as Heaven's Prisoners, at least...
>
>>Characters: Interesting characters, but again, not as intriguing as in
>>"HC".
>
>I didn't think the two sisters were interesting at all, despite Richardson's
>performance; Walters was the only character that even interested me
>marginally...
>
>>Soundtrack: Bleah. So-so. Not very moving. I didn't pay attention to
>>the score for most of the film.
>
>It was quite dull, I thought; completely unremarkable.
>
>>I search in vain for another film to rouse my being as "HC" did. Could
>>be a long wait!
>
>Have you seen Bill Forsyth's excellent film _Housekeeping_? If you haven't,
>it stars Christine Lahti as a rather eccentric aunt who comes to a small
>town in the
>Pacific Northwest to look after her two orphaned nieces, Lucille and Ruthie.
>Both girls are enthusiastic when Sylvie (Lahti's character) comes at first,
>but then Lucille becomes irritated by the way Sylvie is, and becomes
>obsessed with doing things the "normal" way. Ruthie, OTOH, is drawn closer
>to Sylvie, and...it's just a beautiful film, the study of how the characters
>affect one another. HC level, in my book, but some other HC fans have
>suggested that that's going a little overboard.
>
>EB
>--
>"You're not anybody in America unless you're on TV. On TV is where we learn
>about who we really are. Because what's the point in doing anything
>worthwhile if nobody's watching? And if people are watching, it makes you a
>better person."
> -Suzanne Stone (Nicole Kidman), _To Die For_
>
>
>
>
>--------------- END heavenly-c.v001.n038 ---------------
>
> Responding to Bryan's pan & scan vs. letterbox
The guy spitting up blood is in the New Zealand version and so is the scene
with Pauline and Juliet holding hands (and at this point very important
words are exchanged!)
And...here is a stumper for ya! In the scene where Juliet walks in on her
mother and Bill Parry in bed....in the editing Juliets hair just before she
opens the door is Quite long. I would say half way down her back. I am
just seeing things or what?
In the pan and scan version of the film, you are missing
approximately 43% of what was originally filmed. In the NZ version of the
film, it is not letterbox but because it was filmed originally in super 35,
you get the full picture.
>
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n039.5 ---------------
From: Tim Baglio <raven@nas.com>
Subject: Re: Digest heavenly-c.v001.n038
Date: Mon, 27 May 1996 21:32:00 +0000 (GMT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
next time try quoting something useful when you decide to quote 20kb of
messages we've already read.
_______________________________________________
| |
| Tim Baglio http://www.nas.com/~raven/ |
| raven@nas.com Bellingham, WA |
|_______________________________________________|
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n039.6 ---------------
From: Marco Thorbruegge <marco.thorbruegge@kommsrv.RZ.UniBw-Muenchen.de>
Subject: Re: The Holy Grail
Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 08:30:46 +0200
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Hi,
> I noticed, after sending my message, that only three
> people have acknowledged sending similar pleas to Miramax.
Thats four of us. I sent mine much earlier this year (before the mailing-list was set up). I also
wrote to Criterion about a Criterion Edition of HC. From those guys I got really a personal reply
(not so from Miramax), but it was very disappointing .. they said there are no plans so far to set
up such an Edition from HC ... :-(
> Now, I live in
> Australia, and I can (I've been told) walk into any video store and hire
> this much-sought-after video.
The german version is about 10 minutes longer (roundabout 108 min.), but its terribly dubbed. So I
couldnt avoid to buy the NZ-LD ... :-)
bye, Marco
-----------------------------------------------------
Dipl. Inf. Marco Thorbruegge
Universitaet der Bundeswehr Muenchen + Rechenzentrum
Werner-Heisenberg-Weg 39 + 85577 Neubiberg
Tel.: +49(0)89-6004-3222 + Fax.: +49(0)89-6004-3254
--------------- END heavenly-c.v001.n039 ---------------
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-------------- BEGIN heavenly-c.v001.n040 --------------
001 - Bryan Woodworth <bryanw@6 - German "HC"!
002 - Marco Thorbruegge <marco. - Re: German "HC"!
003 - Donald Chin <donaldc@nets - Re: The Holy Grail
004 - Marco Thorbruegge <marco. - Re: The Holy Grail
005 - RUMerry@aol.com - Re: The Holy Grail
006 - michaela drapes <oleanna@ - Re: The Holy Grail
007 - "Chris Black" <qleap@inte - Re: The Holy Grail
008 - kate ann jacobson <kjac@u - Re: "Sister My Sister"
009 - kate ann jacobson <kjac@u - Meet the Feebles
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n040.1 ---------------
From: Bryan Woodworth <bryanw@666.org>
Subject: German "HC"!
Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 01:27:41 -0700 (PDT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Length: 349
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Hi,
Anyone who has seen the German version of "HC" -- (Marco?)
Could you please tell us how it differs from the U.S. release??
b
--
"'Tis indeed a miracle, one must feel,
that two such heavenly creatures are real." bryan woodworth
-- "Heavenly Creatures," 1994 bryanw@borovnia.666.org
http://www.reflection.org/heavenly/
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n040.2 ---------------
From: Marco Thorbruegge <marco.thorbruegge@kommsrv.RZ.UniBw-Muenchen.de>
Subject: Re: German "HC"!
Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 13:07:55 +0200
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Hi,
> Anyone who has seen the German version of "HC" -- (Marco?)
I lent it once but stopped viewing, when the first actor (the teacher) began to speak. The dubbing
was terrible. I watched the english version before and liked the voices of the actors, and I didnt
want to listen to Mel and Kate with german voices (gosh, I hate dubbing!).
So I brought it back with only having seen the first cuple of minutes.
But I am growing curious, so I think I will lean it again this weekend, turn off the sound and
watch it to the end.
I then will inform You about the differences ...
bye, Marco
-----------------------------------------------------
Dipl. Inf. Marco Thorbruegge
Universitaet der Bundeswehr Muenchen + Rechenzentrum
Werner-Heisenberg-Weg 39 + 85577 Neubiberg
Tel.: +49(0)89-6004-3222 + Fax.: +49(0)89-6004-3254
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n040.3 ---------------
From: Donald Chin <donaldc@netspace.net.au>
Subject: Re: The Holy Grail
Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 23:23:50 +1000
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hi all,
9506148v@Magpie.Magill.UniSA.edu.au (Shannon) wrote...
> people have acknowledged sending similar pleas to Miramax. Now, I live in
> Australia, and I can (I've been told) walk into any video store and hire
> this much-sought-after video. However, I have also been told that folks in
> other corners of the world are not so fortunate.
I also live in Australia, but I haven't been able to find the long NZ
version of HC. Have you seen it?
> ps. Has anyone seen the Kate Winslet photo shoot in Premiere magazine?
> I was very disappointed. I guess I'm too much of a purist, but I
> preferred the romantic (and clothed) femme fatale image portrayed in
> HC. Oh well. I hope Hollywood doesn't go to her head.
I saw a few jpeg's of Kate Winslet from that magazine. I wouldn't be too
worried about Kate Winslet's image. She seems to be quite like a chameleon
in the image she shows to the world. Although her movie roles seem to have
her stuck before the 1950's.
Marco Thorbruegge <marco.thorbruegge@kommsrv.RZ.UniBw-Muenchen.de> wrote...
> The german version is about 10 minutes longer (roundabout 108 min.), but
>its terribly dubbed.
Is the dubbing to the same standard as that seen in the German version of
Star Trek?
> So I couldnt avoid to buy the NZ-LD ... :-)
Do you mean you actually got a laserdisc copy of the NZ version? Where did
you get it from?
Regards, Donald
--
Donald Chin <donaldc@netspace.net.au>
"Lost somewhere in Australia...
and fanatical about Heavenly Creatures and Jane Austen!"
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n040.4 ---------------
From: Marco Thorbruegge <marco.thorbruegge@kommsrv.RZ.UniBw-Muenchen.de>
Subject: Re: The Holy Grail
Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 16:06:54 +0200
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Hi,
> Donald Chin wrote:
> > The german version is about 10 minutes longer (roundabout 108 min.), but
> >its terribly dubbed.
>
> Is the dubbing to the same standard as that seen in the German version of
> Star Trek?
Its the same mismatch between original and dubbed voice. Sometimes there are really good matches
(for example the german voice of Robin Williams or Michael Douglas), which they use in every movie.
But most of the time there are different german speakers for the same actor in different movies
(for example Bruce Willis in Die Hard II and III), and thats terrible ....
> > So I couldnt avoid to buy the NZ-LD ... :-)
> Do you mean you actually got a laserdisc copy of the NZ version? Where did
> you get it from?
There is only one Laserdisc available yet, but it is not the long version ... I would already have
written that to this mailing-list ... :-)
(http://www.leo.org/M/title-more?laserdisc%20C8494) but reading this now I am not sure, if
"Production Country: New Zealand" means the Laserdisc or the movie itself ... ??
I bought it from a local Laserdisc-Store in munich ...
--
bye,
Marco
-----------------------------------------------------
Dipl. Inf. Marco Thorbruegge
Universitaet der Bundeswehr Muenchen + Rechenzentrum
Werner-Heisenberg-Weg 39 + 85577 Neubiberg
Tel.: +49(0)89-6004-3222 + Fax.: +49(0)89-6004-3254
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n040.5 ---------------
From: RUMerry@aol.com
Subject: Re: The Holy Grail
Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 12:34:01 -0400
Hi!
In reference to (Shannon) 9506148v@Magpie.Magill.UniSA.edu.au note:
>ps. Has anyone seen the Kate Winslet photo shoot in Premiere magazine?
I was very disappointed. I guess I'm too much of a purist, but I
preferred the romantic (and clothed) femme fatale image portrayed in
HC. Oh well. I hope Hollywood doesn't go to her head.
I was just wondering whicht issue of Premiere she were refering to. Anyone
know?
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n040.6 ---------------
From: michaela drapes <oleanna@mail.utexas.edu>
Subject: Re: The Holy Grail
Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 10:54:47 -0600
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>>ps. Has anyone seen the Kate Winslet photo shoot in Premiere magazine?
> I was very disappointed. I guess I'm too much of a purist, but I
> preferred the romantic (and clothed) femme fatale image portrayed in
> HC. Oh well. I hope Hollywood doesn't go to her head.
>
>
>I was just wondering whicht issue of Premiere she were refering to. Anyone
>know?
Probably the British edition of Premiere, March 1996.
-michaela
--
Michaela R. Drapes
oleanna@mail.utexas.edu
NEW URL! http://www2.cibola.net/~michaela
Will do WWW design for Atomic Fireballs.
--
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n040.7 ---------------
From: "Chris Black" <qleap@interl.net>
Subject: Re: The Holy Grail
Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 15:45:52 +0000
I got my reply today from Miramax and it said, that as of this summer
there are no plans for a release of the original version of 'Heavenly
Creatures'.
Cheers,
--Chris
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--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n040.8 ---------------
From: kate ann jacobson <kjac@unm.edu>
Subject: Re: "Sister My Sister"
Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 16:52:33 -0600 (MDT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
On May 27, Bryan wrote:
> I search in vain for another film to rouse my being as "HC" did.
> Could be a long wait
That's the one bad thing about great movies, books, etc. They always
make you go looking for another just like them, searching for a copy of
the original. And usually, it seems like, there isn't one.
-- kate
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n040.9 ---------------
From: kate ann jacobson <kjac@unm.edu>
Subject: Meet the Feebles
Date: Wed, 29 May 1996 17:31:41 -0600 (MDT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
Hi all,
I'm sure some of you already know this, but Meet the Feebles has now
come out on video here in the US! I watched it last night but couldn't
sit through all of it. It's, uh, a little gross. The style, though,
was all Peter Jackson, and it made me wonder if this guy really knows
how much talent he has! So many young "artsy" directors would kill for
his visual style and sensitivity, and I think it's wierd he used them on
tasteless splatter movies. Not to sound like his mother or anything,
but I hope he makes less "disgusting" movies in the future. The results,
like HC, would go way beyond genius.
Still can't wait for The Frighteners........
-- kate
--------------- END heavenly-c.v001.n040 ---------------
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-------------- BEGIN heavenly-c.v001.n041 --------------
001 - GorillaBlu@aol.com - Parker & Hulme book
002 - "Jefferson F. Morris" <jf - Re: Meet the Feebles
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n041.1 ---------------
From: GorillaBlu@aol.com
Subject: Parker & Hulme book
Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 18:34:18 -0400
Wrote to the new publisher and asked about the book. They
were kind enough to send me a new catalog and I thought
you might be interested in the info about the book.
Parker & Hulme: A Lesbian View
by Julie Glamuzina & Alison J. Laurie
$12.95 paper ISBN 1-56341-065-6
$26.95 cloth ISBN 1-56342-066-4
5½ x 8½ + photographs 224 pgs
[I asked if everything in the cloth book was in the ppback,
including photos and they said yes.]
US orders add $3 s/h for first book & $.50 for each book thereafter
Foreign orders $4 s/h for first book & $1 for each thereafter
US FUNDS/US BANK ONLY
NY Residents add applicable sales tax
Their address is:
Firebrand Books
141 The Commons
Ithaca, NY 14850
(607) 272-0000
website: http://coolbooks.com/~outpost/pubs/fire
Happy hunting!
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n041.2 ---------------
From: "Jefferson F. Morris" <jfmorris@CapAccess.org>
Subject: Re: Meet the Feebles
Date: Thu, 30 May 1996 23:51:21 -0400 (EDT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
On Wed, 29 May 1996, kate ann jacobson wrote:
> I'm sure some of you already know this, but Meet the Feebles has now
> come out on video here in the US! I watched it last night but couldn't
> sit through all of it. It's, uh, a little gross.
I caught it on a bootleg tape a few months ago, which featured an
unbelievably grainy picture. I found it fitfully amusing, and certainly
a technical leap over 'Bad Taste,' though I wasn't crazy about it. I'll
have to rent the new tape and give it another go.
> The style, though,
> was all Peter Jackson, and it made me wonder if this guy really knows
> how much talent he has! So many young "artsy" directors would kill for
> his visual style and sensitivity, and I think it's wierd he used them on
> tasteless splatter movies.
There's a manic, destructive, sadistic adolescent sensibility in the
earlier movies (And I in no way intend those adjectives to come across as
pejorative), which then gets more or less sublimated in HC. As one reviewer
in Film Comment pointed out, if Juliet and Pauline were boys living in the
present day, they might have been making splatter home movies instead of
molding plasticine and drawing. I think Jackson identified with that
anarchic, destructive element in the girls' imaginations, and that's what
drew him to the project. But of course I'm only guessing.
Luckily, Jackson gets to exercise/exorcise his wild side in movies, as
opposed to committing matricide.
> Not to sound like his mother or anything,
> but I hope he makes less "disgusting" movies in the future. The results,
> like HC, would go way beyond genius.
I read in one post-HC interview that he was still interested in
splatter-type films, that he had by no means given them up. Part of me
says, "Go Peter, don't box yourself into nothing but 'tasteful'
projects. You'll spoil your imagination." But then another part of me
says, "If you're capable of serious cinema on the level of HC, don't you
owe it to yourself to pursue that?" So I'm torn. But I've gotta admit,
seeing him do another splatter film, as imaginative and fun as it may be,
might feel a bit like watching Michelangelo draw subversive cartoons.
> Still can't wait for The Frighteners........
July 7, I believe (For us Americans). I certainly hope it's as good as
the buzz would indicate.
--Jefferson
--------------- END heavenly-c.v001.n041 ---------------
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-------------- BEGIN heavenly-c.v001.n042 --------------
001 - 9506148v@Magpie.Magill.Un - Re: Holy Grail
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n042.1 ---------------
From: 9506148v@Magpie.Magill.UniSA.edu.au
Subject: Re: Holy Grail
Date: Sun, 02 Jun 1996 01:30:41 +0930
Hello people -
In reply to Donald Chin asking me about the availability of the NZ cut of
HC in Australia, I have read (somewhere - don't ask me where) that the 'long'
version of HC contains the tennis party at Ilam and a dinner party at the
Hulme's. If this is the case, then the Australian version is the same as the
'long' version, as it also contains these scenes.
However, I do not remember seeing any 'How much is that doggy in the window?'
scene in the car on the way to Port Levy, which is terribly confusing. Is
the Australian version different again? It seems to me as though the version
that I have seen contains some of the 'extra' scenes, but obviously not all
of them. Am I just imagining things? Are the tennis party and dinner party
scenes in all of the versions? What the hell *have* I seen?
Any ideas, people?
Shannon.
p.s. To avoid any future confusion, you might like to know that my name
does not have any relation to my gender - I am, alas ;-), male.
--------------- END heavenly-c.v001.n042 ---------------
From bryanw@borovnia.666.org Thu Jun 6 23:00:59 1996
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From: bryanw@borovnia.666.org (Bryan Woodworth)
To: b@666.org
Subject: ejej
Date: Fri, 07 Jun 1996 06:01:41 GMT
Organization: "Heavenly Creatures" Fan Club
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Subject: Digest heavenly-c.v001.n043
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-------------- BEGIN heavenly-c.v001.n043 --------------
001 - Bao Ly <lybao@earthlink.n - Archiving HC articles online..
002 - "Jefferson F. Morris" <jf - A few thoughts
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n043.1 ---------------
From: Bao Ly <lybao@earthlink.net>
Subject: Archiving HC articles online..
Date: Mon, 03 Jun 1996 20:11:15 -0700
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------14897B965FA"
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
--------------14897B965FA
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Hi everyone,
This "hc-urls" bookmark is for Bryan Woodworth (HeavenlyWeb) as well as
everyone here on
the list. I know this is a rather extensive list; but it is also not a
complete list of
what I have seen.
Recently, I've noticed some of the links are dropping like flies -- and thus,
feeling
the need for archiving them of some sort. Maybe we can make copies of these
and put
them on HeavenlyWeb as a reference before they disappear?
Anyone?
--------------14897B965FA
Content-Type: text/html; charset=iso-8859-1; name="hc-urls.htm"
Content-Disposition: inline; filename="hc-urls.htm"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
<BASE HREF=3D"file:///C|/WINDOWS/Desktop/hc-urls.htm">
<!DOCTYPE FIRSTFLOOR-Bookmark-file-1>
<TITLE></TITLE>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://www.666.org:80/heavenly/" ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LA=
ST_VISITED=3D"800237764">'Heavenly Creatures' rocked my world!</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://www.interlog.com/eye/Arts/Movies/Onscreen/1995/os01=
19b.htm" ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">95-01-19 ON SC=
REEN: Heavenly Creatures</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://www-user.cibola.net/~michaela/kate/" ADD_DATE=3D"80=
0227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">A KATE WINSLET HOMEPAGE</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://www.students.uiuc.edu/~ecoscoll/Anne.html" ADD_DATE=
=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">Anne Perry Home Page</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://www.infoweb.dk/biografnet/film.cgi/heavenly_creatur=
es/film/nhtml/graphics" ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764"=
>Biografnet: Engel min engel</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://pathfinder.com/@@Fa6X@AUAzNmKKv7B/cgi-bin/boards/np=
h-read/15/287" ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">Boards: =
HEAVENLY CREATURES</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://nz.com/NZ/Queer/calendar/1996/960228.html" ADD_DATE=
=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">Canterbury University - 28 Febr=
uary 1996</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://bostonphoenix.com/alt1/archive/movies/filmstrips/HE=
AVENLY_CREATURES.html" ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">=
Capsule Film Review: HEAVENLY CREATURES (1994).</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://desert.net/tw/04-13-95/cinema.htm" ADD_DATE=3D"8002=
27335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">Cinema (April 13 - April 19, 1995)</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://movienet.cultnet.fi/mondonet/movies/heaven.htm#heav=
enlinks" ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">Cinema Mondo- =
HEAVENLY CREATURES</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://pathfinder.com/@@l4WOrgUAzdmw58ud/time/magazine/dom=
estic/1994/941121/941121.cinema.creatures.html" ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LA=
ST_VISITED=3D"800237764">CINEMA: HEAVENLY CREATURES</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://www.citypaper.com/filmclip/filmdj.htm" ADD_DATE=3D"=
800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">City Paper Online - Film Clips D-K<=
/A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://www.u-net.com:80/virtua/cranial/cran05/movies.htm#H=
eavenly" ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">cranial cinema=
</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://pathfinder.com/@@ljPgSwQARNef4nis/time/bbs/crime/01=
77.html" ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">Crime: Heavenl=
y Creatures (Murdering Mom)</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://www.filmzone.com/IndependentFilm/deadalive.html" AD=
D_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">DEAD-ALIVE</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://www.nrc.nl:80/Web/Archief/Film/Rec/heavenly.html" A=
DD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">Film & Video archief</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://www.telebyte.nl:80/bioscoop/film/pitches/heavenlycr=
eatures.html" ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">Film Pitc=
h</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://ets.cac.psu.edu/TrailBlazing/sites/film.html" ADD_D=
ATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">Film Sites</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://www.cs.rochester.edu/u/ferguson/announce.www/1996.0=
2/14074.html" ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">FILM: Hea=
venly Creatures Site: Visit The Fourth World</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://www.informatik.rwth-aachen.de/FilmStudio/film/p9510=
23.html" ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">FILMSTUDIO: He=
avenly Creatures</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://www.prairienet.org/business/opti/950401-flicks-tab.=
html" ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">Flicks</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://orion.csuchico.edu:80/Archives/Volume34/Issue7/Ente=
rtainment/Gianbu'HCr.html" ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"8002377=
64">Girls anything but 'Heavenly Creatures'</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://www.film.com/film/reviews/archives/keogh1994/heaven=
ly.keogh.html" ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">Heavenly=
Creatures</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://www.vicnet.net.au/vicnet/metro/heavenly.htm" ADD_DA=
TE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">Heavenly Creatures</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://www.gfi.uib.no:80/~frodel/cinema/heavenly_creatures=
.html" ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">Heavenly Creatur=
es</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://www.uni-stuttgart.de:80/UNIuser/filminfo/sose1995/u=
fi0613.html" ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">Heavenly C=
reatures</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://stefan.www.media.mit.edu/people/stefan/movies/heave=
nly.html" ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">Heavenly Crea=
tures</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://www.kaapeli.fi:80/~hff/015.html" ADD_DATE=3D"800227=
335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">Heavenly Creatures</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://www.miramax.com/dlpages/heavendl.html" ADD_DATE=3D"=
800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">Heavenly Creatures</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://www.fbk.eur.nl/FFR/catf/catpagf/k0057.html" ADD_DAT=
E=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">Heavenly Creatures</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://www.movienet.com/movienet/movinfo/heavenlycre.html"=
ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">HEAVENLY CREATURES</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://www.dds.nl/~filmhuis/recensies/heaven95.htm" ADD_DA=
TE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">Heavenly Creatures</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://www.gfi.uib.no/~frodel/cinema/heavenly_creatures.ht=
ml" ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">Heavenly Creatures<=
/A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://mosaic.echonyc.com/~lambda/heavenly.html" ADD_DATE=3D=
"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">Heavenly Creatures & Violence</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://www.sr.bham.ac.uk/~dbc/Movies/Reviews/Heavenly_Crea=
tures.html" ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">Heavenly Cr=
eatures (1994)</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://uk.imdb.com/M/title-exact?title=3DHeavenly+Creature=
s" ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">Heavenly Creatures (=
1994)</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://movie.infocom.net/docs/joined_reviewfiles/HEAVENLY_=
CREATURES.html" ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">HEAVENL=
Y CREATURES (a Nebbadoon Syndicate review by Joan Ellis)</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://www.kentuckyconnect.com/heraldleader/movies/fl/heav=
enly.html" ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">Heavenly Cre=
atures -- February 3, 1995</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://www.healey.com.au/~lelak/heavenly/interview.html" A=
DD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">Heavenly Creatures Inter=
views & Articles</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://open.cc.etf.hr/%7Edalbor/movies/reviews/heavenly.ht=
ml" ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">HEAVENLY CREATURES,=
review by Jeffrey Graebner</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://hyperreal.com:2000/R868795-870736-1m/music/lists/am=
bient/text/amb.9505" ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">ht=
tp://hyperreal.com:20...s/ambient/text/amb.9505</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://lasarto.cnde.iastate.edu/Movies/CultShop/movies/jac=
kson/heavenly_creatures.3060" ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"8002=
37764">http://lasarto.cnde.ias...heavenly_creatures.3060</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://lasarto.cnde.iastate.edu/Movies/CultShop/movies/jac=
kson/heavenly_creatures.3120" ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"8002=
37764">http://lasarto.cnde.ias...heavenly_creatures.3120</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://lasarto.cnde.iastate.edu/Movies/CultShop/movies/jac=
kson/heavenly_creatures.3146" ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"8002=
37764">http://lasarto.cnde.ias...heavenly_creatures.3146</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://lasarto.cnde.iastate.edu/Movies/CultShop/movies/jac=
kson/heavenly_creatures.3277" ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"8002=
37764">http://lasarto.cnde.ias...heavenly_creatures.3277</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://www.hype.com/movies/reviews/heavenly.htm" ADD_DATE=3D=
"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">http://www.hype.com/movies/reviews=
/heavenly.htm</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://www.spd.louisville.edu/~cksvih01/pumpkin/reviews/he=
avenly.html" ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">http://www=
.spd.louisvil...n/reviews/heavenly.html</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://www.warehouse.net/dutton/movies.html" ADD_DATE=3D"8=
00227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">http://www.warehouse.net/dutton/movi=
es.html</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://www.well.com/user/finc/mvff/74.html" ADD_DATE=3D"80=
0227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">http://www.well.com/user/finc/mvff/74=
.html</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://www1.iol.it/cinema/stampa/48.html" ADD_DATE=3D"8002=
27335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">http://www1.iol.it/cinema/stampa/48.htm=
l</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://www1.iol.it/cinema/stampa/49.html" ADD_DATE=3D"8002=
27335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">http://www1.iol.it/cinema/stampa/49.htm=
l</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://www.hip.cam.org/~orson/" ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAS=
T_VISITED=3D"800237764">Jean Gu=E9rin</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://www.city.fi/vanhat/3_96/kkleffa2.html#anchor185751"=
ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">Kuukauden elokuva</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://www.kol.co.kr/~DJUNA/links.html" ADD_DATE=3D"800227=
335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">Links</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://www.marquee.com/bin/texhtml?form=3Dreviews.info&rev=
iewid=3D144" ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">Marquee Mo=
vieServer=AE Review - Heavenly Creatures</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://www.best.com:80/~scottz/movies/meet.the.feebles/" A=
DD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">Meet the Feebles</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://www.film.com/reviews/M/meet.feebles.stranger.html" =
ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">Meet the Feebles</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://pathfinder.com/@@4wS1WAQAP9cm8Mzy/cgi-bin/boards/np=
h-read/15/287/1" ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">Messag=
e: HEAVENLY CREATURES</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://pathfinder.com/@@4wS1WAQAP9cm8Mzy/cgi-bin/boards/np=
h-read/15/287/2" ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">Messag=
e: Heavenly Creatures/Perry</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://www.vicnet.net.au/vicnet/metro/metro102.htm #conten=
ts" ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">Metro ATOM Magazine=
</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://www.brad.ac.uk/%7Eirpurdie/movies.html#heav" ADD_DA=
TE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">Mosher's Movie Review Archive=
(Page 1)</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://euphony.com/euphony/reviews/movie_H.html#HeavenlyCr=
eatures" ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">Movies:Review:=
Alphabetical Listing - H</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://euphony.com/euphony/reviews/movie/HeavenlyCreatures=
-BH.html" ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">Movies:Review=
: HEAVENLY CREATURES, review by Ben Hoffman</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://euphony.com:80/euphony/reviews/movie/HeavenlyCreatu=
res-BF.html" ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">Movies:Rev=
iew: HEAVENLY CREATURES, review by Bryant Frazer</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://euphony.com/euphony/reviews/movie/HeavenlyCreatures=
-JB.html" ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">Movies:Review=
: HEAVENLY CREATURES, review by James Berardinelli</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://euphony.com:80/euphony/reviews/movie/HeavenlyCreatu=
res-JG.html" ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">Movies:Rev=
iew: HEAVENLY CREATURES, review by Jeffrey Graebner</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://euphony.com:80/euphony/reviews/movie/MeetTheFeebles=
-JB.html" ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">Movies:Review=
: MEET THE FEEBLES, review by James Berardinelli</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://tufvan.hv.se/~jkusv93/BadTaste/BadTaste.html" ADD_D=
ATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">Nalic Nod - A tribute to Bad=
Taste</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://www.cat.pdx.edu/%7Ecaseyh/horror/maps/NewZealand.ht=
ml" ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">New Zealand</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://nz.com/NZ/" ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"=
800237764">New Zealand / Aotearoa on the Web -- New Zealand Guidebook. Ak=
i</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://www-leland.stanford.edu/~jmgeorge/nzfilms.html" ADD=
_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">NZ films</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://www.cat.pdx.edu/~caseyh/horror/director/jackfilm.ht=
ml" ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">Peter Jackson Filmo=
graphy</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://lasarto.cnde.iastate.edu:80/movies/cultshop/movies/=
jackson/creatures.html" ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764"=
>Peter Jackson's Heavenly Creatures</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://lasarto.cnde.iastate.edu/Movies/CultShop/Movies/jac=
kson.html" ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">Peter jackso=
n's Homepage</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://www.bluemarble.net/~theryder/march3/private.html" A=
DD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">Private Worlds: Nell and=
Heavenly Creatures</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://www.uta.fi/~tlakja/heavenly.htm" ADD_DATE=3D"800227=
335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">Review: Heavenly Creatures</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://pathfinder.com/@@elwCdgQAwtfJvCSp/ew/941125/movies/=
vanya_heaven.html" ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">Revi=
ews: Vanya on 42nd Street/Heavenly Creatures</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://www.mint.net:80/movies/1995summer/heavenly.html" AD=
D_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">RRSQ - Heavenly Creatures=
</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://lasarto.cnde.iastate.edu:80/movies/cultshop/" ADD_D=
ATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">The Cult Shop</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://www.helix.net/~adamabr/creatures.html" ADD_DATE=3D"=
800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">The Doorway to the Fourth World</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://web3.starwave.com/showbiz/scoop/interview/perry.htm=
l" ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">The Green Room: Anne=
Perry, by Scott Roesch, April 17, 1996</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://www.io.org/~sdh/winslet.html" ADD_DATE=3D"800227335=
" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">The Kate Winslet InfoThingy</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://www.film.com/film/industry/interviews//heavenly.cre=
atures.lyman.html" ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">The =
Man Behind Heavenly Creatures</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"file:///d|/program/smrtmrks/catalog/CACHE/TEMP/4afd2d8b.ht=
m" ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">The Rather Unofficia=
l Kate Winslet Homepage</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://desert.net/tw/film/h.htm#HeavenlyCreatures" ADD_DAT=
E=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"800237764">Tucson Weekly's Film Vault - H=
</A>
<DD>
<DT><A HREF=3D"http://www2.ncsu.edu/ncsu/stud_pubs/Technician/issues/dec/=
jan_11_1995/Etc/2etc.html" ADD_DATE=3D"800227335" LAST_VISITED=3D"8002377=
64">Two girls and `Heavenly' murder</A>
<DD>
--------------14897B965FA--
--------------- MESSAGE heavenly-c.v001.n043.2 ---------------
From: "Jefferson F. Morris" <jfmorris@CapAccess.org>
Subject: A few thoughts
Date: Tue, 4 Jun 1996 20:34:32 -0400 (EDT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
This long, rambling message will be posted in two parts. If you don't
feel like reading it, I won't hold it against you.
The other night I sat down and watched a really good movie called
`Heavenly Creatures.' I took the time to jot down a few notes while I
could (toward the end, of course, my scribblings became more sparse, as
they involved taking my eyes off the screen). The following is a
somewhat show-offy list of things I've noticed, along with a bit of
commentary. My take on things.
Much of what I'm saying may already be in the FAQ. But I figure that if
we restricted our discussions to topics which aren't covered in the FAQ,
we'd literally have nothing to talk about.
BTW, I'm issuing myself a license to be a bit pretentious here. If
that's not your frame of mind, then feel free to read no further, but
please don't tell me I'm reading too much into anything.
___________________________________________________
The Newsreel: Reminds me a bit of the beginning of `Blue Velvet.' We're
being presented with the public face of Christchurch--all summer days and
domestic bliss. It's the kind of image that's impossible to present
without irony in a film these days. HC is no exception. From the first
few seconds of the reel, we know that this tranquillity is meant to be
broken.
The Ship: The way they cut away from Hilda and Henry before they turn.
It's almost like a convention from a horror film--as if their faces are
too monstrous to look upon. Of course at this point the first-time
viewer has no idea whatsoever who these people are or what this sequence
signifies. The cut also creates a sense of abbreviation and
incompleteness--we know that this scene is important for some reason and
that it will be continued at some later point.
Paul's stocking: On the surface, Paul doing her stocking as she goes
outside is simply a sign that she's in a hurry. But there's a sexual
element to it as well. A mild foreshadowing of the appetite which will
come to drive Paul in the second half of the film. Of course this also
ties in with all the walking/feet imagery (Which I still have yet to
figure out).
Visual contrast: Jackson sets Pauline apart from the rest of the group
beautifully. We immediately know, without anything being said, that
she's something of an outsider. In the shot of her half-heartedly
mumbling the hymn, she stands out immediately--a frizzy-haired brunette
in a sea of carefully beretted blondes. She's also looking in a
different direction than everyone else, obviously uninterested in the
proceedings. This apparent lack of interest in conventional religious
ritual will also find its outlet in her relationship with Juliet, when
they create a self-deifying religious faith of their own.
Juliet's eyebrows: During her theatrical entrance--waiting for Ms.
Stewart to actually say her name before sweeping into the room--her
eyebrows are almost contemptuously arched, as if these lowly Kiwi
students (and teachers) are barely worthy of her gaze. And the Kiwis
fall right in line--Elizabeth Moody's orgasmic response upon hearing of
Juliet's background still makes me chuckle. And when Ms. Stewart
momentarily forgets to mention Juliet's noble homeland ("I am actually
from England, Ms. Stewart"), we get another haughty little eye lift. All
this class posturing may be silly, but it will prove tragically important
to Paul as the film goes on.
Be My Love: Melanie Lynsky's reaction to the opening strains is
absolutely priceless. It's as if she's never heard music before. But
then Dad has to screw it all up, first with his Irish joke, and then,
more seriously, with the fish. Paul's spirit is soaring on waves of
romantic passion...and then Herb feels compelled to waltz in waving a
smelly reminder of the family's exceedingly modest means of livelihood.
Is there anything less romantic than a dead fish?
Ilam: The Princess on the bridge (Peter Dasent's musical cue is literally
called, `The Princess of Ilam.' BTW, if you don't have the soundtrack,
turn off you computer right now, go to a store and buy/order it). With
that magnificent track-in on Paul's face when she sees Juliet, we now
realize the object of Paul's romantic dreams. The film's love story is
told using the cinematic conventions usually applied to heterosexual
romances. Romeo has seen the light breaking. Paul is officially smitten.
The Evil Prince Runnymeade: As they chase after Jonesy in the first of
the `hysterical giggling and running' scenes that Laurie found so
annoying (I guess she and her friends prefer strolling), we see Juliet
and Paul in their respective positions at this point in the story--leader
and follower. As she limps valiantly after Juliet, Paul is being led
into the magical new world of `music, art, and pure enjoyment' that will
change her perceptions/expectations/aspirations forever. The lighting in
this scene is particularly notable--Juliet's locks are bathed in a golden
glow, like a saint of goddess out of a renaissance painting.
In the House: The plasticine horses on the mantle hearken back to the
drawings of horses Paul was making in Ms. Waller's class. They seem to
represent another of Paul's fantasies. Didn't Freud say something about
horses? Not that I take Freud too literally, but it seems rather
appropriate here. Pauline may just be drawing them, but Juliet actually
has one (She refers to it when she tells Paul that Mr. Perry has agreed
to buy it for 50 pounds). And of course, there's the unicorn thing (More
on that later).
The Shrine: The atmosphere of this scene, in which Juliet introduces Paul
to the basic tenets of their alternate religion, is marvelous. Dasent
takes scraps of melody from the Ilam theme, particularly one three-note
motif, and alters it, making it odd, haunting, magical, and foreboding
all at once.
It: Now I'm sure we all know what `It' is. As Juliet runs through the
other pronouns/saints, Pauline gazes at her in a way that can only be
described as rather...amorous. And then she makes her first individual
contribution to their personal mythology--The saint of sex and violence,
`It.' Juliet isn't ready for `it' yet, but we know that Mr. Welles can't
be escaped forever.
Meet the Riepers: Despite her best efforts, Paul can't hide her family's
lower class background from Juliet. Melanie Lynsky looks as if she's
trying to curl herself into a ball throughout the scene, especially when
John the idiot boarder starts his tour of the house. And of course
there's her pitiful attempt to save face after her father reveals his
job--"He's the manager." More priceless facial expressions.
The Handshake: when Juliet and Honora meet, Dasent clues us in to the
coming discord with a little note of dissonance in the midst of his
otherwise jaunty and playful music for this scene. We realize that
Juliet and Honora represent forces in Paul's life which can't exist
harmoniously for too long.
Jumping In: As they run down the dock in their bathing suits, Juliet is
still the leader, but she isn't willing to take the plunge. Paul,
however, feels no qualms. Her position as leader in the second half of
the film is foreshadowed here, along with her willingness to `dive in'
and experiment with sensual pleasures. Remember where the picture of
Orson ended up after Juliet discarded it? I don't know, maybe I'm taking
this Freudian stuff too far.
Domestic bliss: More wonderful faces from Ms. Lynsky. We see by her
expression as Hilda brushes her hair that this is exactly where Paul
wants to be, and how she wants to live--with the Hulmes, as their
daughter. The ship scene from the beginning of the film begins to
resonate now. We realize whose fantasy it is. Paul wants to escape her
workaday life and see the world as a member of the upper class.
Birth: Note the apparent grimace of strain and effort on Juliet's face
just before she opens her eyes and sees the Fourth World. It's as if
she's giving birth to it in her mind. And then it appears. I don't
think the girls are actually experiencing any kind of mutual
hallucination, but rather that Jackson is taking us directly into their
minds to see the world they're jointly imagining. And (New Yorker
reviews notwithstanding), I think the tactic works. Brilliantly.
Gloriously. Magnificently.
The Butterflies: It was at this point, during my first viewing, that I
officially began to love this movie. I wish they'd gone ahead and put in
the huge dragonflies that are referred to in the script.
Another Birth: As Deborah squeezes out Diello, we get a confirmation of
Paul and Juliet's respective positions--Paul as male, and Juliet as
female. They don't stick to these roles exclusively, though (Paul's
feminine side comes out in Gina later on).
---(That's enough for now. I'll post more later.)---
--Jefferson
--------------- END heavenly-c.v001.n043 ---------------